Most who seek surrogacy overseas, which is now punishable by jail terms and fines, are heterosexual couples

Most who seek surrogacy overseas, which is now punishable by jail terms and fines, are heterosexual couples

  • NOT_RICK@lemmy.worldEnglish
    123·
    16 hours ago

    Nation suffering from demographic collapse making it even harder to have children. Fucking idiots

  • yeahiknow3@lemmings.worldEnglish
    910·
    34 seconds ago

    You’re paying some impoverished exploited person to destroy her body giving birth so you can take away the baby… in a world on the verge of resource collapse with 8 billion humans boiling alive and countless orphans, the rich have found yet another scheme to make things worse.

    EDIT: medically illiterate morons in this thread arguing that giving birth should be commodified: Fuck. You. Ignorant misogynistic dipshits.

    • LesserAbe@lemmy.worldEnglish
      71·
      14 hours ago

      What do you think about “altruistic surrogacy”, mentioned in the article? Presumably if someone is volunteering that avoids the exploitation angle?

      Approaching from another angle, do you think sex work should be legal? It’s another area where exploitation and abuse are a concern. But if we expect someone can earn money using their body in one area (sex work, or even just physical labor) then why should it be illegal to earn money by carrying a baby to term? Exploitation should be made illegal, not the act itself.

      Lastly, my understanding is that surrogacy is more often used when a woman is unable to carry the baby, than when a man is unable to impregnate.

      I hear you that rich people are selfish and causing any number of problems. That said, I think your approach misses the suffering of many normal people who want to raise a child and would be unable to otherwise.

      Even if this was an activity that someone thinks should be restricted, should it be punishable with jail time? I don’t think so. The law in Italy seems clearly designed to target LGBT people.

      • yeahiknow3@lemmings.worldEnglish
        34·
        4 minutes ago

        Volunteering is fine, paying is not. Selling your organs is illegal for good reasons. Btw, there’s consensus in the philosophical literature that commodified surrogacy is immoral.

        People use their bodies for work, true. The difference when it comes to giving birth is that

        1. each birth costs between 2 and 4 years of lifespan (let me know if you want links to the medical research).
        2. giving birth is the most intense endocrinological process in the animal kingdom. It can be psychologically devastating, especially if you need to give up your baby.
        3. there’s no good reason to do it. When you hire someone to work with their body (for instance, construction) we consider the risks associated with that work and weigh them against the need for that work to get done (its utility). Is there an alternative? Is it really worth it? How much would people get hurt? What’s the possibility for exploitation? Simply put, whereas many types of physical labor have to get done and aren’t all that harmful, we tend to make illegal the ones that don’t need to get done or which are harmful. For instance, we don’t look kindly on mining for radioactive material without protective equipment. We have OSHA, we don’t allow you to be paid to chop off your own body parts for someone else’s amusement, etc.
        4. it’s dangerous! In the United States donating a kidney — yes, having a kidney cut out of your body — is safer in the long (and short) term than giving birth. If we allowed surrogacy, we would have to allow organ selling, which is technically safer. That’s the death knell of civilized society. Political arguments will be, “why should we help the poor when they can sell their organs or do surrogacy.”

        Regarding sex work, you’re right; it’s so profitable and ubiquitous that making it illegal creates a black market, which is one of the main sources of harm for that industry; legalizing and regulating it makes it less exploitative and dangerous. The opposite is true for surrogacy, which is neither ubiquitous nor profitable (hence the exploitation of poor foreign girls).

        • LesserAbe@lemmy.worldEnglish
          11·
          3 hours ago

          I think it’s a strange position to take that giving birth is like handling radioactive material.

          • yeahiknow3@lemmings.worldEnglish
            1·
            1 minute ago

            Yes, giving birth is a major medical event, one that is quantifiably more harmful than losing a kidney. Is this news to you? Are you a moron or a psychopath?

    • Electric@lemmy.worldEnglish
      31·
      12 hours ago

      You raise some good points in here and down below. I’m wondering if people have to go through all the trouble to have someone else conceive a child, why not just adopt? No one has to risk their health and you’d be giving a child a (hopefully) better life.

      • yeahiknow3@lemmings.worldEnglish
        23·
        6 hours ago

        If people cared about children, they would adopt, but they are selfish and have an obsession with passing on their own shitty genes.