• Giyuu@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
    192·
    4 months ago

    I go back and forth on Hasan. But in general I think he occupies an important part of the pipeline that isn’t an actual dead end ala destiny/vaush. And whilst he has criticised China, the last time I heard him do that it was honestly rather feeble or felt like stock criticism (“they could loosen up censorship”). Then he’s got gigachad Xi/China emojis that you’ll see in his chat all the time. This is obviously the beginning of normalizing China for many watchers, not unlike the memes that many of us saw on GenZedong before reddit shut it down (although GZ was way more radical).

    This, with his connections to the deprogram, who directly interface with non-MLM Marxist theory, is a pipeline. From there you’re a hop away from Professor Wolf, who isn’t far from Geopolitical Economy Report/Hudson/Prashad etc. I’d like to see a bit more direct interface between creators at the level of the deprogram etc make an effort to lead to Wolf/GER a bit more but I’m so out of the loop with “breadtube” maybe that’s already happening.

    Hasan (and the deprogram, but especially Hasan as a giant “influencer” ) does have to work within a capitalist framework which makes him petty bgz but it feels wrong to group him with the rest.

    There absolutely can be a contradiction between his material interest of keeping his followers vs keeping the valve to the pipeline open. Maybe he could make more an effort to lead his followers to unknowingly allow themselves to fall further down the pipeline, but again Ive moved beyond that area of the pipeline (as you’re supposed to) and haven’t made an effort to monitor it so I can’t offer much more than just giving an outline of how this works and what problems can arise.

    • Abolish Amerikkka@lemmygrad.mlOP
      5·
      4 months ago

      The important question is: Once you reach the end of the pipeline, do you stop making memes and only read theory, or do you still make memes for those that are below the pipeline (or I guess above the pipeline since pipelines go down)?

      • Giyuu@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
        7·
        4 months ago

        If making memes is what you like to do, ideally you read some theory to help make memes that better convey ML ideas. Only reading theory is not enough by itself.

        Also I kinda will walk back, or maybe clarify, a little of what I said, specifically about Hasan “occupying an important niche”. Whilst he occupies that niche, that’s not to say that he’s the only person in that niche nor that there’s only room for one person in there. Also not saying that someone else cant come along and do better.

        But the real world results matter and I know there are a lot of people here who might not be here without Hasan, myself included. And remember not everyone is going to become a Marxist when you’re that high up on the pipeline.

        • Abolish Amerikkka@lemmygrad.mlOP
          2·
          4 months ago

          And remember not everyone is going to become a Marxist when you’re that high up on the pipeline.

          Can you please elaborate a bit more on this last part?

          • Giyuu@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            2·
            4 months ago

            You’re trying to get as many people introduced to Marxist ideas as possible. And whilst you will get some people to explore further down and eventually some will become Marxists, others will reject it or stay aligned on only certain issues. That’s just how it is.

            This kind of applies to every level of radicalization to be honest, bar like once someone grasps the historical materialist/scientific interpretation of history. But that is much further down the pipeline than someone like Hasan is.

            So for example he will have some viewers who become Marxists after hearing the deprogram podcast and then checking out Hakim, and then falling even further down (Hasan has been on the deprogram), whilst some viewers might stay and watch Hasan only for info about Palestine, or some may stay social democrats.

  • supersolid_snake@lemmygrad.ml
    14·
    4 months ago

    Missing Robert Evans and a few others.

    Mixed on brace beldon (he did ultimately contribute to a third of Syria being occupied on a very miniscule level, but I don’t think that was intentional)

    • MeowZedong@lemmygrad.ml
      9·
      4 months ago

      I’d say Brace is generally fine, but that could be because I find his bits funny. I don’t really follow celebrities, so I may be missing things. He seems to generally have good takes and joined the YPG with good intentions. Everyone has flaws and will be imperfect.

    • I_CAST_BEAM_OF_BATS_I_CAST_BOLT_OF_BATS [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
      101·
      4 months ago

      If you see the feds pulling out a second former YPG guy who mysteriously gets a ton of popularity over the Epstein case (TA with the launch of their pod and Helali finding the second black book with the patch notes removing mossad “off ebay” and then getting blasted into minor relevance by the daily beast) and you don’t question what’s going on here, is there any hope for you?

      Worth mentioning Evans though, I remember when he was just a Funny Cold War Facts writer on Cracked which was introduced to me by a more bazingafied classmate.

      • supersolid_snake@lemmygrad.ml
        7·
        4 months ago

        Yep, that’s why I question these things. I stopped listening when he had on a guest justifying the Syrian intervention and I was like, I am done with this shit. You don’t get to have a say in Syrian affairs as some sort of drug rehab.

        Evans is an admitted fed and justifies every intervention in the mid east and beyond. I instantly avoided Evans podcast as I sensed something was off. He would go all ham on people like Stalin and then make excuses for people like Reagan. Even not being knowledgeable I knew the fucker had an agenda and it wasn’t good.

    • I_CAST_BEAM_OF_BATS_I_CAST_BOLT_OF_BATS [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
      16·
      4 months ago

      No 🙌 basically this is describing politics as it appears on popular streaming services and Twitter through commentators who turn media criticism (already derivative of the US ruling class and stays on the defensive) and summaries of current events and online gossip (which is often cast as current events these days) into fuel for their own grift which can become its own fake events. The specifics of these people, The Young Turks and Majority Report type people or whatever, Breadtubers who find esoteric angles to criticize peripheral countries that have naughtily nationalized their natural resources, gaming streamers who have Gotten Political, the specifics of all that IMO aren’t that important unless we’re drawing up a collection of all their paper trails and collaborations (in which case you realize holy shit this doesn’t matter and shouldn’t exist)

      Bottom right tried to funnel young anarchists into a militia fighting on the same side as Azov battalion and US mercenaries with obvious fed Jake Hanrahan though and gets a salary from Amazon 😉 the rest are worse

      The point of each of these people is their status as fake online friend to many allows them to capture an audience that traditional media never would and so they’re maintained as a part of this media apparatus.

      This shouldn’t be considered “politics” at all, it’s somehow even more insipid and immaterial than the tiny Communism Themed parties and groups that are part of the activist-NGO complex (IWW, Teamsters, PSL, DSA, CPUSA, any other org is even less relevant than that afaik)

      The western left is truly fucked don’t get me started on Eurocommunists

        • I_CAST_BEAM_OF_BATS_I_CAST_BOLT_OF_BATS [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
          2·
          4 months ago

          I think it attracts quite good people this is more of a structral issue related to how the party actually works, where it gets funding (Becker network is really weird and PSL is pretty much the leftiest part of it), and whether its goals extend beyond small marches and digital outreach or involve actually getting on ballots widely

          The fantasy football version of PSL I had before I looked into this trot funding network was the best. Just like certain local anarchist and trot orgs briefly interested me until I got to see for myself

          Ultimately the PSL is beholden to particular NGOs and this is really where you can start getting to the root of what it is, behind their promotional materials and dogmatism

          Sorry for vague posting I don’t want anyone to be able to cross reference this with any blogs…

        • I_CAST_BEAM_OF_BATS_I_CAST_BOLT_OF_BATS [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
          1·
          4 months ago

          Similarly if I picked a Cpusa article where they pretend to understand and affirm SWCC or zeroed in solely on the DSA international committee, I could conjure a really cool and good fantasy version of them in my head.

          All this really confirms to me at this point is this thing has teeth and is meant to consume well-meaning people political energy. I didn’t have such a strong mental image of it until ACP announced. Now it’s like I got the last chaos emerald or some shit. I’ve been in a frenzy expanding some of the work centered around these notes like Becker already

          The complete ideological incoherence is clear to me now

  • Stizzah@lemmygrad.ml
    91·
    4 months ago

    You must be American: the only left in this picture is the last guy (no, not Walter White) and he’s a socialist. Liberals are center/center-right, liberals support capitalism, liberals are just another enemy of the left, when the fuck you will understand?

    • commiespammer@lemmygrad.ml
      101·
      4 months ago

      that’s the point of the whole meme, to show how ridiculous the state of the ‘left’ is in the west. They are even labeled as such.

    • Abolish Amerikkka@lemmygrad.mlOP
      4·
      4 months ago

      Yeah, I didn’t make this meme. I just found it very funny because it is total satire. It just shows the absolute decadent state the left is in the USA. And yeah, I just assumed that Hasan being there was a just a joke to people saying that he is a billionaire or how Yugopnik says “Hassanabillionare” lol.

            • Aradina [She/They]@lemmy.mlEnglish
              14·
              4 months ago

              I’m not telling you to take this somewhere else I’m telling you that you’re incomprehensible to people who aren’t excessively online

              • I_CAST_BEAM_OF_BATS_I_CAST_BOLT_OF_BATS [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
                14·
                4 months ago

                Maybe you should check whether you’re on one of the “never stop posting” communities that get exponentially more fired up when banned from mainstream social media next time. Because you’re just encouraging me.

                The fact is if you all stay like this, glued to this influencer circus until war with Iran, it will be my big payoff. These posts are my reassurance nobody is on my level or even trying.

                There was a chance, you know, that somebody would know more the past few years. Correct me here and there. Add to it. But no, it’s just me and the boys now. I gotta go over everyone’s head as usual. Been waiting.

                Confused? Of course you are. You’re always confused. That’s what you do. You log on and talk about how confused and scared you all are and reassure each other you’re stuck that way. Glued to the people manipulating you.

                I’ve never met anyone who watched Youtube or Twitch or Twitter a lot who didn’t have something seriously wrong with them. I don’t think I ever will.