It’s weird, in the moment, I get blindsided by an interaction and only after it’s over to I realize I said or went along with things I didn’t want to. I’m trying so hard not to talk to people and I want to change that. I’m avoiding people because I’m scared of interacting and getting it wrong.
I can protect myself, but that means against everyone. Like I can deflect with humor or defend myself and so I keep people at a distance. I’m pushing people away, I’m avoiding them that badly. Because the truth is, I don’t assert myself at all. I’m afraid that asserting myself will hurt people.
But I know I’m hitting a wall and that’s from me not being assertive.
How do you know when you’re doing too much or too little assertiveness? Do you have an internal sense of that? The way I sense it is by looking at the person for signs of pain or discomfort when I talk. So I hold back when I know what I’m saying might be something they don’t want to hear.
What helps you know when you’re being appropriately assertive?
Hey OP, I’m a little late but wanted to try and chime in, because I’ve been dealing with this exact issue for the last few years (before I knew I was Autistic). First, I just want to say that your feelings matter. If you’re uncomfortable, if your anxiety is high and you’re feeling overwhelmed, it is perfectly okay to say so and remove yourself from that situation if you’re able. We don’t process things like NT people and might need more time or energy to do the same tasks or participate in the same events, and it’s important to keep that distinction in mind when you’re trying to navigate daily interactions. Be kind to yourself, as hard as that may be with the conditioning we’ve experienced in an NT world.
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How do you know when you’re doing too much or too little assertiveness? Do you have an internal sense of that?
Kind of, yes. If I get really emotional, and teary-eyed and want to run away, I’ve come to understand that this is a conditioning that has me betray my own needs for the sake of others and that I need to fight through it. When I go against the urge to people please and instead try to make room for myself, it feels wrong, but I know now that fighting that wrongness is what will lead me to a more honest existence. But, even after years of practice speaking up for myself, and trying to set boundaries that are healthy and suitable to my well-being, it’s still difficult to say, “No, I don’t want that” or “I’d be more comfortable with X”. I constantly question my own motives, my vocabulary, my freaking body language, all of it, trying to bend over backwards to not be ‘too loud’, ‘too assertive’, and/or ‘too demanding’ and it is exhausting. The truth is, for myself, I’m so aware (and wary) of people around me that I’m already not going to go out of my way to cause problems unless I am being outright abused. Knowing this, it’s easier to address the smaller things, like saying no to added work or navigating social situations where I can just exist without having to constantly worry about everyone around me. You can’t control others through your action or inaction. Try not to let the fear of other’s emotions dictate how you navigate your own.
Ask yourself this: Is what I’m doing really too much? Am I really demanding something that is unreasonable? Think of a person who you find is too assertive. What don’t you like about the way they go about it? What do you see them doing that gets their needs met that doesn’t piss everyone off? If you pay attention, which I’m sure you already are, you’ll learn ways to establish boundaries without sacrificing so much of yourself. It takes practice, and will be different for everyone. It has gotten a little easier for me, but there will always be times when it’s more difficult than others.
The way I sense it is by looking at the person for signs of pain or discomfort when I talk. So I hold back when I know what I’m saying might be something they don’t want to hear. I’m afraid that asserting myself will hurt people.
I feel this so much. Unfortunately, this is a reality that needs to be addressed and accepted. Odds are that you’re gonna freak people out when you actually speak up for yourself the first time, if there is an established relationship like with family members or coworkers. I’ve had a lot of therapy, read a LOT of psych and self care books/articles/blogs (shout out to Devon Price’s Unmasking Autism and other ND communities), and I’ve come to realize that my body tells me a lot about where I am emotionally, even when I’ve not fully processed what’s going on in my head. Exhaustion, nervous energy, sweating, needing to stim; all of these things are usually indicators that something is off and needs to be addressed. It’s not always immediate, but I’ve found that bringing up something that happened in the past can be just as effective as addressing it in the moment if it is a recurring thing.
The first time I actually asked for something I needed, I started crying. As in, full-on tears streaming down my cheeks, anxiety-attack-around-the-corner shaking and freaking out. I was terrified in that moment that I was asking too much, that I was being a burden, that I was making the other person uncomfortable, and that I was somehow wrong for even bringing up my feelings that had, up until then, been trampled and manipulated by others who were completely oblivious to my struggle because I never let them see the real me, and who were perfectly satisfied by my people-pleasing, codependent mask. To say it was jarring is an understatement, and I used the template Zuzak mentioned to do it ( “This is how your actions make me feel, do with this information as you will”). The response was…not great. The person I was talking to seemed to have an internal system crash error that caused them to react with anger and defensiveness, because how dare I call them out of their established patterns with me and make them self-reflect on their own behavior. I was accused of a lot of things I wasn’t (selfish, rude, blah blah blah) and that my “boundaries were making others uncomfortable”. I type that now and can’t help but laugh/cry at the absurdity of it. What a horrific response, to have someone who will only accept you if you fit their specific mold, do what they say when they say it, and never question their motives. How dare I act like an individual person with needs and wants and feelings!
That being said, keep in mind that when we do stand up for ourselves, and when we ask things of the world around us, the response isn’t always going to be pleasant, especially when there is a list of unspoken rules that we’re trying to navigate. (You can see this mirrored in the US with our rights being taken away–the problem goes all the way to the top.) Facing this is a really hard wake-up call, and I’ve come to accept the fact that not everyone will like me. And that’s okay, as long as I’m being treated with respect and not being forced to do things that make me want to delete myself from existence. I have been able to apply this thinking to several jobs I’ve had, where I had to say no even if it meant not being on the Boss’ ‘Perfect Employees’ list, but I always did my job and and did it well even when I was going through burnout and depression and just trying to survive. In a work environment I would suggest more caution, since work culture is more of a cult culture than an actual working environment where things get done, but you don’t need to sacrifice your own comfort for the sake of others. It’s important to remember that everyone is human, including you, and more than likely you aren’t the only one who is feeling a certain way in such an environment.
TL:DR Being assertive doesn’t have to be the same as being an asshole, or being rude, or mean. Usually it just means you have a strong sense of self. Having standards, having boundaries, and having a sense of self worth is not something people can take away from you, though they may try. You can’t make everyone happy, and you certainly can’t get your own needs met by sacrificing them for others who will never do the same for you. Navigating relationships and people is difficult and requires putting yourself out there and accepting the consequences. If you fuck up, apologize. Make an effort to be the person that feels the most genuine to you, and go from there. Try not to betray yourself for the sake of keeping other people happy, and don’t let fear stop you from standing up for yourself if you feel uncomfortable. And if you’re struggling with all of that, look for resources to help you understand why and how you do the things you do, odds are someone else has gone through something similar. Ask yourself why, then ask why again. Whittle it down into something concrete that you can really examine and work on, like saying ‘no’. It’s all easier said than done, and takes time. Being patient with yourself is so important, and know that there are people out here, like me, cheering you on and trying to make changes too. I hope this helps a little bit, sorry for the huge text post. I really want to see everyone here succeed through their struggles, and I think with enough of us trying and supporting one another, we can make it happen.
Thank you for writing so much that resonates with my experience and fears. I saw my issues stemming from being on the spectrum, but I didn’t quite make the connection between masking and how deeply that behavior can reach.
Thank you for talking about your first time actually asking for something and the response you got. It sounds scary, but I want to try and see what happens. If people get upset because I’m not miserable, that’s okay. I think I’ll try small and see where I can go from there.
I believe in you! It’s so hard to make changes sometimes, and navigate people. Take care of yourself as best you can.
I have no idea but most of the responses here were unhelpful
Assertiveness isn’t something that exists in a vacuum. “How do you know when you are being assertive enough” - is like asking, “How do you know if you’re running fast enough” - well, what are you running from, and is it catching up to you yet? Your level of assertiveness is enough when it’s sufficient to protect you from others and get what you want/need from them.
You say you tone down your assertiveness because you’re concerned about hurting others. But by not asserting yourself, you are hurting yourself. You compromise on things you want/need and disrespect yourself. You are also a person and so if you hurt yourself in this way it’s also a really bad thing! But you might be so sensitive to the potential pain of others that you have become numb to the sensation of your own present pain.
Or, to put it another way, you may have learned to devalue yourself relative to others to such an extent that their discomfort is “real” or “valid”, but yours is “fake,” “exaggerated,” something you need to manage or get over. This is a message we get societally when we’re neurodivergent.
I believe the holistic direction out of this place is to become alive to the pain you are currently accepting for yourself. You are sensitive to the needs of others. You are afraid of hurting them. But that hurt is already happening, to you, in your body. Can you stop it?
A piece of advice I found helpful is to frame things in terms of expressing how people’s actions make you feel. If you frame it as an objective or accusatory thing, people are more likely to argue or get defensive, but if you just say, “when you do X it makes me feel Y” (be specific) then it doesn’t leave as much room to argue. The majority of people have an innate drive to avoid making other people feel bad, and a lot of problems can be caused by a lack of awareness rather than malice. But people also have a drive to avoid accusations of wrongdoing to preserve their ego and social status. So if you just bring an issue to their attention and say, “This is how your actions make me feel, do with this information as you will,” it can often work better in terms of getting them to change their behavior as compared to being more forceful.
A lot of times when someone doesn’t express when something’s bothering them, they start ruminating about the person and coming up with all sorts of negative thoughts about them, even if the offender is well-meaning and simply unaware of what they’re doing. This can lead to overcorrecting and blowing up in their face, or it can lead to pushing them away without ever giving them a chance. And avoiding it obviously doesn’t get them to change their behavior. Counter-intuitively, being assertive can make people like and respect you more because people usually don’t want their peers to just be pushovers. It’s ok if they’re defensive in the moment, not every interaction has to go positively at every moment.
If you follow the advice of framing it in terms of how you feel, it should make it easier to stand your ground. They can make excuses and that’s fine, just stick to the core point. “I understand that [their excuse], I’m just letting you know that it makes me feel [emotion].” You know your emotions better than they do, so there’s no reason for you to back down on that point. And once you’ve communicated your feelings, you can drop the subject and move on. Even if it looks like you “lost” the argument in the moment, it can still be effective at changing their behavior.
This advice works well in my experience for voluntary peer-level relationships. If they don’t change even when they know it’s bothering you, then maybe they’re not worth trying to be friends with. But you shouldn’t just assume that before you’ve brought it to their attention and given them a chance to correct their behavior.
How do you deal with involuntary relationships, like someone in a position of authority who you can’t easily walk away from, who doesn’t give a shit how you feel? Fuck if I know. Do a revolution and abolish hierarchy. In the meantime, you gotta ask someone else because I’m terrible at that. But I also used to be terrible at asserting myself in my personal relationships too and this advice did a lot to help me find the right balance.
This website is what I’m drawing from and I found it to be a great resource for recontextualizing how I thought about the issue. Assertiveness doesn’t have to be about putting others down, and done properly it’s an important part of a healthy relationship.
T-pose to assert dominance over your social enemies and feed upon their terror
Is this work related? Like saying or going along with things you didn’t want to?
I guess it depends on situation, but in personal situations, there’s the good old “I’m not comfortable with that, sorry”. If they are not willing to respect your discomfort, you shouldn’t have to respect theirs.
In work situations the same should apply, but not everyone is in a position to risk losing their jobs, so it gets more… professional. You’d have to assess your relationships, leverages, and the power dynamics to find the best strategy. But it comes with practice, conversation and reviewing, to get you experienced with other people.
If anything, it’s worth remembering that everyone is just people. Afraid, struggling and just doing their best from what they got. Usually willing to support each other in the struggle. :)
It’s at work, but in general I end up being too accommodating and willing to nod and smile through interactions to avoid friction.
I appreciate the feedback. I think I’m too good at avoiding conflict but I want to give people a chance to be people.
the police are called to come kill you
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