I asked a job related question the other day on here and got some really helpful answers, so I was hoping you all could give me some further insight into this.
Basically, I have a chronic illness which means I spend most of my time at home and I’m largely disconnected from other people and don’t really have anything in the way of references. I’ve owned my own business for the last several years selling products online, but that business has been declining for awhile and I’m looking into customer service type jobs that I could do from home.
If a company asks for references, how would I work around that?
Tbh…just lie. Base it firmly in reality though and get your story straight. Astroturf the entire reference with people you know, who may or may not have been involved with the reality. Make it believable to the rest of the application. Chances are your references will be passed over entirely anyway while whoever is doing the bare minimum to get through their work day checks over your application.
This may or may not be good advice. 🤷
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Companies and business owners lie to people and their employees all the time, you have no moral requirement to be honest with them either. Everybody lies to get ahead, it’s fine.
It’s a shame that it’s come to this, but you’re absolutely right @[email protected] . One does what they must to get by.
Hard disagree from me. The whole corporate culture where I am in aerospace teaches that even small lies or minor unethical behavior can cause profound reputational impacts for the person and the company. I think it’s bad advice.
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I’ve been a hiring manager for many years. I rarely check references, and when I do it’s because I’m on the fence about someone. If I checked a reference and had even a hint that it was bogus, it would turn me into a hard no. My bar for ethical behavior is pretty high.
I think it’s much better advice to just be honest. There’s no harm in providing friends as references as long as you explain it and are up front about it.
Use your friends.
If it doesn’t ask for a “professional reference,” that’s on them. Shit, use your mom.
This. Use friends, colleagues, people you know, that know you well and would be able to answer questions about your personality and work habits. The rest of the answers in the comments are not good advice.
What about in the absence or care of those due to being a more private person? It’s always felt somewhat strange to give a stranger some personal contacts simply to vouch for you…Or maybe that’s just me.
So much this! I think using references is bullshit so ask anyone you trust to have your back
Don’t lie, that’s bad advice. Instead, be honest just like you been here.
Tell them “I’ve owned my own business for the last several years, but covid hit me pretty hard. I haven’t had a manager that I’m still in contact with prior to those years”
Over on Reddit, there was a sub for people who would volunteer to write references and act as references. I don’t remember exactly what it was called, but there are helpful people out there.
Is your business rated on Google or Yelp? You could offer that to prospective employers because it reflects your customer service skills.
I’ve had to do hiring before, and I would not count a lack of references against you if you were upfront about being self employed. Heck, I’m trying to get my own business off the ground now. Being self employed for a decent length of time speaks volumes about your ability to be responsible.
Unfortunately it’s not. We’ve had plenty of extremely pleased customers over the years and received emails to that effect, but they aren’t personal relationships. Would it be strange or treated as illegitimate to have an attachment with that sort of positive feedback?
I would only do it if the job posting requested references along with your application. If it’s not mentioned, wait for them to ask you for references.
Do you have any customers who could act as references? I’m not sure what you sell, but if you have a few people write statements that say ‘MossBear sold me a ____ and they were very helpful. They always have a great attitude and are very knowledgeable about ______’ or something like that.
References aren’t the end-all-be-all, but if you’ve done a job and you want to prove you did it well, finding anyone who can act as a witness to how you did that job is useful. It doesn’t have to be coworkers or a manager. Customers, suppliers, anyone: ‘MossBear has been buying office supplies from me for ____ and they always pay their invoices on time.’
Yeah, I do have a lot of positive emails from customers over the years. If that wouldn’t be weird, I could totally put that together.
As a person who has hired a lot of people, I think that’s completely fine, and way better advice than the people who suggested that you make stuff up.
That’s good to hear. I had one professional job before starting my own business and my boss from that job died several years ago, so my current and past customers is all I really have.
I’ve hired people who had their own business for a decade or more prior, so they didn’t have fresh references. It’s worrisome when someone’s resume says they’ve worked for multiple companies in the last several years but they can’t give you a reference, but lots of people can’t for good reasons.
Also worth noting that many companies, including the one I work for, don’t allow management to give references. Apparently some people have sued because they felt a poor or mediocre reference cost them a job, and some companies just don’t want to take the risk when there’s no benefit to them. So lots of companies are used to not being able to get references for one reason or another.
I think references are much more important when you’re hiring a nanny or something like that, where a resume might not tell the story.
I’d put the dead boss as a reference. Even if they do try to call and find out what happened to him, they don’t know that YOU already know that.
There used to a be a reddit sub where you could post a a request for references and random people would offer to help. I don’t know if such a thing exists in lemmy land. Could you ask a neighbor?
Claim you worked for twitter and was laid off. I doubt Twitter has a HR department to verify the claim but considering how public the layoff was they may just believe it.
You have to kind of hope though that your prospective employer does not use a company like HireRight to do a background investigation that includes references and may ask for W2s as proof. On another note, fuck HireRight. They’re fascists.
Be honest. Say you don’t have references so that you intend to prove yourself from day one.
Most hiring we do is based on what we can find publicly and how the conversation goes. If you have more to show, that helps. We hire (developers) based on code and gut-feeling. We don’t do the roles you are looking for but if you have been looking for a longer time already, open an issue on an open source reository you care about and ask how you can help sort out tickets and ask follow-up questions.
Companies search for value (often money, but smaller copanies tend to search broader). For customer support I expect that to mean “low monetary investment (including training), high output”. Perhaps they need some flexible additional support. Ask them what they need, see if you can offer that, explain/convince how you will bring offer that and ask if they see improvements to the plan.
PS: also what andrewgross said. Customers count, friends can count. And having ran a business that worked is a great reference to show you do what is necessary.
I mean it’s just a customer service role, you know they need you. Your application will be supported simply because you are willing to work and a nice enough person showing enthusiasm.
Don’t lie, just tell the truth.
The American Dream: Unpaid Internship / volunteer To Gain References
I usually say “I’ve kept my work relationships exclusively professional and communication with references stayed within the scope of the project.”
Well… The thing is, employers are looking for professional references. What you describe doesn’t explain why you don’t have any references.
Ask some happy customers whether they’ll act as a reference.
