It often feels like there are only 3 productive hours in typical American white collar work day.
What if we just cut out the rest?
Edit: Some great responses. So responses must have also been said about the 5 day and 40 hour work weeks.
After 3 hours you’d go to your next job.
As opposed to going to your next job after 8 hours?
no but you could have 2 jobs and still work less.
Then you miss out the unmentioned part of the work - idle thinking. Not only the time spent typing something on the keyboard is work. All the time spent thinking how to solve a problem is also work.
All the time spent thinking how to solve a problem is also work.
try telling that to every manager i’ve ever had.
Walking to get a coffee is when I’ve solved some of the most complex problems in my head. Walking to get a coffee was also one of the few times I’d leave my desk. What even was lunch…
Or the fact that most jobs are not behind desks or keyboard…
Office drones forget that society requires different types of work done to function… They ways got that bias lol it is cross cultural too
That’s not how my employer measures productivity. They use keystrokes per minute. Gotta get good at idle typing.
This is true. I tend to do my best thinking away from work, and not part of my current work time.
“I got no work done at all today, it was all back to back meetings!”.
My wife, regularly.
For many jobs, it won’t change much. My advisor comes to the university 3 days a week, and stays for 4 ish hours. But he’s a very good researcher with high research output. (I do math, this might not be possible for lab based researchers.)
Usually these jobs can’t be measured in hours you spend in your workplace. You’re kind of always working since you can’t really turn your brain off while working on an interesting problem, but what others see is that you’re sipping coffee with your laptop open.
I thoroughly believe that 4 hours is the limit for most people (on most days) on how long they can focus deeply on a problem. That was at least my experience as a mathematics grad student. In math this is more evident because most of high level math requires this deep level of understanding.
Of course one thinks about these problems while doing other things (obsession is a common consequence of prolonged deep thinking), which is why visits to the restroom, walks outside and so on are famous to prove very productive.
Either way, math is also social (most problem solving benefits from discussion) and it is in my opinion much more productive to set some time off for talking about / working on stuff with others than grinding through longer. This is still work and incidentally also good time and resource management.
Of course. My friends who are doing research on Physics or Biology tell me that I always seem to be free. The truth is, I’m always kind of working. It’s very hard to shut off your brain when you’re tackling with some intriguing problem. I’ve found myself thinking about work while out with the boys for drinks lol.
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3 hours a day wouldn’t be that useful. You still have to “be” somewhere 5 days a week.
What is useful; I did this for a few years; 3 x 8hr days. Mon - Wed, normal work hours, and a 4 day weekend. No need for “public holidays” even paid time off becomes less relevant, when you can switch one week to Wed - Fri. Leaving Thur - Tue as a “normal” way to take time off, giving a 6 day weekend possible every second week.
Everyone cant have all the same days off, there is already divide between service and shift workers and everyone else, a longer weekend would make it worse. The time off has to be spread around and Holidays do need to exist to make exceptions so everyone can hangout at the same time.
Agreed, but crossing over on Wed would work out for changes.
It kinda sucks that there’s a prime number of days in a week.
Good thing a week is arbitrary. Maybe we can change this!!
morning coffee, break, afternoon coffee, go home
As a non-white-collar worker, I always find conversations like this very alienating. The idea of being on the clock while not working is bizarre to me.
That’s why a lot of roles like this are salaried. My productivity can’t be measured by how fast I turn a crank.
Yeah at that point in the career, the comp is for being available during business hours and moving work in professional, reliable and competent manner. Nobody is checking unless somebody is complaining.
People could add tasks but there is no pay incentive so why bother. That’s just give out labour for free lol
Dont be a bootlicker. Get paid!
Why would you be on the clock? You work 3 hours and that pays enough money.
For many office workers, it would be about the same.
you get up at 12 and start to work at 1, take an hour for lunch and then at 2 you’re done.
What about my 15 minute breaks?
To be honest, while I feel while this is true for many jobs, we should also keep the people whose jobs where this isn’t possible in mind.
Congratulations you just figured out how to have four jobs without breaks.
I think the problem would be getting everyone’s 3 hours to line up.
Yes. A whole lot more would need to be asynchronous.
You couldn’t organise anything. I honestly can’t see how h the status quo can be changed.
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Sadly we are so obsessed with squeezing “productivity” en masse out of the workforce. We rarely justify technology or process enhancements that result in fewer hours worked. We generally optimize how much we get out of each hour worked. I have always had an issue with this.
Take AI for example, we are seeing some tasks automated or accelerated by AI powered tools. However, I have not heard any employers state how their employees will be able to get their work done in fewer hours. I only ever hear how people will get more done during their work hours.
The system in this way is very much broken. In an ideal world, you’d get paid for the outcome and not the hours worked, but that is not a working relationship many outside of entrepreneurs and consultants have.
I would struggle get anything done. 3 hours is just not enough time. Sometimes it feels like 8 isn’t even enough.
5 would be decent i think. If you can’t get through a “part” of a task, however you define that in your field, that should either be broken up more there are other issues
Sounds like a management issue tbh
Oh yeah it 100% is. I don’t mind though because I like being busy and of I don’t get all the work done no one faults me. Me days feel like they are 5mins long it’s great. I arrive at work get stuck in and then look at the clock and fuck its 5pm time to go home.
I’m not sure I could condense my work like that. If I have 3 hours of work I want at least 4 hours to do it in. And if you decide you can condense it, employers will simply double everyone’s workload, and we are not computers. Maybe 3 hours of work is all anyone can do in a day, and some of us can do it in 3:15 but most of us like to spread it over 8. Plus there are insights that only come in non-active time, again, we aren’t machines.
i think there’s a different “sweet spot” for everyone. i agree, doing 3h of productivity in 3h is hard enough, but i wouldn’t necessarily need to stretch it over 8h, i’d do fine with 5-6h. my last work hours tend to be the most unproductive ones anyway
Ok. Let’s say we have 4 hour workdays, 4 day work weeks. Not just for white collar.
A business would require to hire 2 more people to cover a 24h continuous prosuction line (3 8h shifts to 5 4h shifts).
there would be more employment and higher productivity. More happiness I suspect.
I’d take it.
A lot has been said about that when talking about universal basic income. The idea is that people could work half shifts and make the rest up under UBI
6 x 4 = 24
you are entirely correct., and the first person to spot my simple math mistake.
thanks for correcting 😊
