It is a citizens’ initiative for the EU. Ross has been consulting with legal experts and even members of parliament in these territories in order to get this off the ground. This is not some feel-good change.org thing; this has legal ramifications, albeit with an absurdly high threshold to clear.
Gambling is bad and it ruins lives. So let’s get some legislature. Oh noes, now there can be no kissing or depiction of blood in any game because sex ruins lives and so does murder!
This is a strawman. We do legislate gambling already. Several countries have legislated loot boxes already without adding violent content on as a rider.
This initiative, which again, has actual legal implications unlike most petitions you’ve ever heard of, can only ask for so much before it’s in lawmakers’ hands. Terminology like “reasonably functional” is used all over laws on the books, and courts rule on what is reasonable or not. It would be reasonable to say that a video game is no longer functional if you can’t play it anymore. Lobbyists and special interest groups are why we have an industry subsidized by legalized gambling for children and other ways of fucking us over.
Lobbyists and special interest groups are why we have an industry subsidized by legalized gambling for children and other ways of fucking us over.
And vagueries that will be interpreted by courts that likely have no knowledge of what a vidya game even is will resolve that?
People complain about it but there are a lot of reasons you do not want courts to actually rule on basically anything “tech” outside of special situations. Imagine if you were trying to convince your grandparent who still has a landline how cryptocurrency works and that their decision would actually become a law.
We have to hope they do, because the industry would love to never resolve this on its own. So far there are reasonable laws on the books in places in places like Belgium and Australia for things like loot boxes. Also, you do your argument a real disservice by using childish language like “vidya games” and “oh noes”.
So rather than advocate for some vagueries that are primed to be corrupted… maybe actually start with those specific actionable laws to establish precedent that can be worked on.
Because a judge who has no idea what a vidya game is: “Oh, my grandson plays that gotchinson impact game. He is a good kid so clearly this is a different problem and this case is trash”. Or, more likely “Minecraft?!?! THAT IS THE GAME WHERE YOU HAVE UNCENSORED SEX WITH PROSTITUTES AND THEN MURDER THEM!!!”. Because the vast majority of court cases don’t have proper experts involved but still lead to precedent that can cause problems down the line. Hence why there is a lot of pressure to settle when “tech” ends up in court.
Also: If your only argument is that I am not taking the “Stop Killing Games” movement seriously enough? You don’t have one. Which… is par for the course.
I agree. Hence this initiative. Nothing will change without action, is this is the action that EU citizens can feasibly take. I’ve written my legislators, and that’s about all I can do in the US, other than spread the word on social media.
Also: If your only argument is that I am not taking the “Stop Killing Games” movement seriously enough? You don’t have one. Which… is par for the course.
I agree. Hence this initiative. Nothing will change without action, is this is the action that EU citizens can feasibly take. I’ve written my legislators, and that’s about all I can do in the US, other than spread the word on social media.
Relying on favorable interpretations of “reasonably functional” is just begging lobbyists and lawyers to ruin it for everyone.
Pushing for legislature with specifics that are actually good is how we get precedent.
“Stop Killing Games” is the former and most of “the movement” is twitch streamers telling their audiences what they want to hear.
Relying on favorable interpretations of “reasonably functional” is just begging lobbyists and lawyers to ruin it for everyone.
As is explained by Ross in the very video good over this initiative:
If it’s successful in getting the votes then the EU will base what they do off of expert opinion and consultation. You’re going in with the assumption that it’ll work exactly as it does in the US it seems, which is silly as shit to do
Ah, my mistake. I was not aware that lobbyists and special interest groups did not exist in the EU, that only the most qualified of consultants were hired, and that all laws were perfect.
Again, there is a way to set this up to win and there is a way to set this up for knee jerk reactions and “I trust 420JustBlazeItGaming_XXX because they are advocating on my behalf. I should use their offer code for tv dinners”. This is very much the latter.
But it is also being done in a way that, should this get enough traction in the demographics that actually matter, it can lead to a lot of bad legislation that will have global implications.
Instead we see remarks like
The industry has already ruined it for everyone. This is the best plan we’ve got to fix it.
That make it clear this is not about actually making beneficial pro-consumer legislature. It is about hurting developers for making “bad” games. And… I can’t imagine any other Movements that might be taking advantage of this. If only we had more Ethics In Games Journalism, am I right?
It is a citizens’ initiative for the EU. Ross has been consulting with legal experts and even members of parliament in these territories in order to get this off the ground. This is not some feel-good change.org thing; this has legal ramifications, albeit with an absurdly high threshold to clear.
This is a strawman. We do legislate gambling already. Several countries have legislated loot boxes already without adding violent content on as a rider.
This initiative, which again, has actual legal implications unlike most petitions you’ve ever heard of, can only ask for so much before it’s in lawmakers’ hands. Terminology like “reasonably functional” is used all over laws on the books, and courts rule on what is reasonable or not. It would be reasonable to say that a video game is no longer functional if you can’t play it anymore. Lobbyists and special interest groups are why we have an industry subsidized by legalized gambling for children and other ways of fucking us over.
And vagueries that will be interpreted by courts that likely have no knowledge of what a vidya game even is will resolve that?
People complain about it but there are a lot of reasons you do not want courts to actually rule on basically anything “tech” outside of special situations. Imagine if you were trying to convince your grandparent who still has a landline how cryptocurrency works and that their decision would actually become a law.
We have to hope they do, because the industry would love to never resolve this on its own. So far there are reasonable laws on the books in places in places like Belgium and Australia for things like loot boxes. Also, you do your argument a real disservice by using childish language like “vidya games” and “oh noes”.
Hoping things will turn out great is for idiots.
So rather than advocate for some vagueries that are primed to be corrupted… maybe actually start with those specific actionable laws to establish precedent that can be worked on.
Because a judge who has no idea what a vidya game is: “Oh, my grandson plays that gotchinson impact game. He is a good kid so clearly this is a different problem and this case is trash”. Or, more likely “Minecraft?!?! THAT IS THE GAME WHERE YOU HAVE UNCENSORED SEX WITH PROSTITUTES AND THEN MURDER THEM!!!”. Because the vast majority of court cases don’t have proper experts involved but still lead to precedent that can cause problems down the line. Hence why there is a lot of pressure to settle when “tech” ends up in court.
Also: If your only argument is that I am not taking the “Stop Killing Games” movement seriously enough? You don’t have one. Which… is par for the course.
I agree. Hence this initiative. Nothing will change without action, is this is the action that EU citizens can feasibly take. I’ve written my legislators, and that’s about all I can do in the US, other than spread the word on social media.
I wasn’t making that argument at all.
Relying on favorable interpretations of “reasonably functional” is just begging lobbyists and lawyers to ruin it for everyone.
Pushing for legislature with specifics that are actually good is how we get precedent.
“Stop Killing Games” is the former and most of “the movement” is twitch streamers telling their audiences what they want to hear.
As is explained by Ross in the very video good over this initiative:
If it’s successful in getting the votes then the EU will base what they do off of expert opinion and consultation. You’re going in with the assumption that it’ll work exactly as it does in the US it seems, which is silly as shit to do
Ah, my mistake. I was not aware that lobbyists and special interest groups did not exist in the EU, that only the most qualified of consultants were hired, and that all laws were perfect.
Again, there is a way to set this up to win and there is a way to set this up for knee jerk reactions and “I trust 420JustBlazeItGaming_XXX because they are advocating on my behalf. I should use their offer code for tv dinners”. This is very much the latter.
But it is also being done in a way that, should this get enough traction in the demographics that actually matter, it can lead to a lot of bad legislation that will have global implications.
Instead we see remarks like
That make it clear this is not about actually making beneficial pro-consumer legislature. It is about hurting developers for making “bad” games. And… I can’t imagine any other Movements that might be taking advantage of this. If only we had more Ethics In Games Journalism, am I right?
The industry has already ruined it for everyone. This is the best plan we’ve got to fix it.