If Poland defeats Germany at the beginning of the war, then America never joins the fight. The country doesn’t get swept up in a patriotic Nazi killing phase, and therefore public sentiment never views Nazis as cartoon baddies. The Klan is never stopped, the space race doesn’t happen, man never lands on the moon, and Nixon converts America into a fascist dictatorship in the 1970s. Also, Star Trek is never made.
If Poland defeats Germany at the beginning of the war, then America never joins the fight. The country doesn’t get swept up in a patriotic Nazi killing phase
It also doesn’t become an industrial and military powerhouse, tries to instigate a war with Canada, gets their ass kicked (again).
Discussions like this makes me wonder if the reason why time travelers can never kill Hitler…is because Hitler himself was a time traveler, and somehow the future determined he was a necessary evil at a particular point in time. Like…the original timeline was worse than Hitler.
In no way I am minimising and justifying the innumerable deaths, but Hitler wreaking havoc weakened European powers which forced them to give up their colonies. It was an opportunity for independence movements across the world. Granted European powers still tried to retain their colonies, but they could never re-establish their moral authority without being called hypocrites after rallying the world to fight for independence against fascism. European in-fighting was a boon for colonies.
It would leave a bad taste in one’s mouth for saying this, but colonialism is arguably the bigger evil due to its longer legacy because it had been happening far longer than Nazis had been in existence, and long before the group came into existence. One may also argue that fascism is an evolution from colonialism. One of Hitler’s motivation after all to conquer land was the fact that Western powers have their colonies. Germany did request for their ex-colonies in the Pacific to be returned from Australian administration but was of course rebuffed. And everyone knows Hitler openly admit drawing inspiration for genocide and euthanasia from the United States.
Additionally, without the Allied values of liberal democracy, there would not have been inspiration for the American civil rights movement to forward social justice and equality.
This is why I think it is such a Western-centric meme to try to kill baby Hitler. Without the war, it would not have opened the eyes of the West from hypocrisy and many of the things we take for granted today would not have been possible.
Tbh Dan carlin does something similar. He points out how Germany homogeneity allowed it for fellow citizens to pass real meaningful work reforms. All thr technology and medical advances would’ve never happened.
Sort of a spoiler but not really a spoiler (the way Dune is written there aren’t really spoilers), the series is about saving humanity by creating a leader so bad that they never let themselves be controlled again. In Dune Messiah, Paul (not the one who finally saves humanity because he couldn’t be bad enough) compares how many people he’s killed to figures in History, like Hitler and Genghis Khan.
He [Ghengis Khan] killed the way I kill, by sending out his legions. There’s another emperor I want you to note in passing - a Hitler. He killed more than six million. Pretty good for those days.
If Poland defeats Germany at the beginning of the war, then America never joins the fight. The country doesn’t get swept up in a patriotic Nazi killing phase, and therefore public sentiment never views Nazis as cartoon baddies. The Klan is never stopped, the space race doesn’t happen, man never lands on the moon, and Nixon converts America into a fascist dictatorship in the 1970s. Also, Star Trek is never made.
It also doesn’t become an industrial and military powerhouse, tries to instigate a war with Canada, gets their ass kicked (again).
Discussions like this makes me wonder if the reason why time travelers can never kill Hitler…is because Hitler himself was a time traveler, and somehow the future determined he was a necessary evil at a particular point in time. Like…the original timeline was worse than Hitler.
In no way I am minimising and justifying the innumerable deaths, but Hitler wreaking havoc weakened European powers which forced them to give up their colonies. It was an opportunity for independence movements across the world. Granted European powers still tried to retain their colonies, but they could never re-establish their moral authority without being called hypocrites after rallying the world to fight for independence against fascism. European in-fighting was a boon for colonies.
It would leave a bad taste in one’s mouth for saying this, but colonialism is arguably the bigger evil due to its longer legacy because it had been happening far longer than Nazis had been in existence, and long before the group came into existence. One may also argue that fascism is an evolution from colonialism. One of Hitler’s motivation after all to conquer land was the fact that Western powers have their colonies. Germany did request for their ex-colonies in the Pacific to be returned from Australian administration but was of course rebuffed. And everyone knows Hitler openly admit drawing inspiration for genocide and euthanasia from the United States.
Additionally, without the Allied values of liberal democracy, there would not have been inspiration for the American civil rights movement to forward social justice and equality.
This is why I think it is such a Western-centric meme to try to kill baby Hitler. Without the war, it would not have opened the eyes of the West from hypocrisy and many of the things we take for granted today would not have been possible.
Tbh Dan carlin does something similar. He points out how Germany homogeneity allowed it for fellow citizens to pass real meaningful work reforms. All thr technology and medical advances would’ve never happened.
You sound like someone who would enjoy reading Dune (and the sequels).
You are not the first person to say this, but I’ve never read it. I’ll put it on my list.
Sort of a spoiler but not really a spoiler (the way Dune is written there aren’t really spoilers), the series is about saving humanity by creating a leader so bad that they never let themselves be controlled again. In Dune Messiah, Paul (not the one who finally saves humanity because he couldn’t be bad enough) compares how many people he’s killed to figures in History, like Hitler and Genghis Khan.
Also Tolkien doesn’t put his experiences of the horrors of war into Lord of the Rings, which means Dungeons and Dragons never gets popular.
Well, his horrors were from the first WW. That still happens without Hitler.
I assume not, but are you Nilaus the YouTuber?
I am not. But a lot of people do assume and ask me questions about factorio.
You should just go with it and make shit up.
Lol. Thought about it, but I would have to know wtf factorio is all about🤣.