There’s an emerging blue-state nightmare: Inspired by President Donald Trump’s call to round up immigrants who are in the country illegally, red-state governors might start sending their National Guard troops into blue states without those leaders’ permission.
if Trump were to federalize National Guard units, there’s nothing the state could do to prevent it; a presidential order preempts state authority.
And yet I remember not so long ago at the Texas border where Abbott refused to have the NG stand down when Biden ordered it. So there’s precedent already there to ignore Cheeto in Charge’s orders
Whoever wrote this needs to go back and read Thomas Jefferson or pretty much any history of any collapsing authoritarian regime in history.
They could obey the orders. Or, they could say “lol no”. What’s he going to do, activate their remote-control collars?
The US military, National Guard included, goes through training that heavily emphasizes support for the constitution and what to do about illegal or unconstitutional orders.
It’s actually pretty dangerous to start to bend the knee to an authoritarian despot in this way. By presenting Trump’s illegal bullshit as some kind of pre-ordained structure that other people will have to follow, of course, because that’s the system, they are normalizing it. Even if he were following US law, which he isn’t, they’d have the option to tell him to go fuck himself, and they’d be in some excellent historical company in doing so.
Exactly. People need to move past this mindset that assumes these rules, and traditions, and norms are laws of nature. No, they’re just ideas that people created and no hand of god is going to sweep out of the sky and smite you if you just don’t do them. We need to start acknowledging and participating in the increasingly asymmetrical warfare that Republicans started.
I was a soldier and was taught to tell anyone who gives me an illegal order to fuck off. Including the president. You are absolutely not protected just because a superior gave you an order.
It’s a good thing that there is no history of soldiers obeying illegal orders and committing atrocities. Of course, there are plenty of people in the military who are quite happy obeying those orders because they agree with them.
And luckily they didn’t purge military leadership that’s actually loyal to the constitution, and then use Republican congressional obstruction to prevent promotions for 4 years so Trump could install loyalists…
As much as we like to assume soldiers will follow orders and doctrine as if they were computers running code…they are ultimately human beings with their own free will, reasoning, biases, and agendas, to hell with what is and isn’t legal and proper on paper. It would be a crossroads for the country and everyone who serves.
One of the oldest rules of quelling rebellion is to not use the local soldiers to do it. Too much emotional attachment. Bring in an outside force, preferably ones with standing ethnic or political hatred for those you want to crush.
Why would blue states fear only red state national guard if this is the case? The local guard would have to enforce the federal edicts, right?
I guess if they don’t, the only two options are do nothing or confront the invading guard, the latter of which sounds a lot like civil war.
And yet I remember not so long ago at the Texas border where Abbott refused to have the NG stand down when Biden ordered it. So there’s precedent already there to ignore Cheeto in Charge’s orders
Whoever wrote this needs to go back and read Thomas Jefferson or pretty much any history of any collapsing authoritarian regime in history.
They could obey the orders. Or, they could say “lol no”. What’s he going to do, activate their remote-control collars?
The US military, National Guard included, goes through training that heavily emphasizes support for the constitution and what to do about illegal or unconstitutional orders.
It’s actually pretty dangerous to start to bend the knee to an authoritarian despot in this way. By presenting Trump’s illegal bullshit as some kind of pre-ordained structure that other people will have to follow, of course, because that’s the system, they are normalizing it. Even if he were following US law, which he isn’t, they’d have the option to tell him to go fuck himself, and they’d be in some excellent historical company in doing so.
Exactly. People need to move past this mindset that assumes these rules, and traditions, and norms are laws of nature. No, they’re just ideas that people created and no hand of god is going to sweep out of the sky and smite you if you just don’t do them. We need to start acknowledging and participating in the increasingly asymmetrical warfare that Republicans started.
Isn’t it illegal to obey illegal orders? Good soldiers don’t follow illegal orders, at least; even if not illegal itself.
I was a soldier and was taught to tell anyone who gives me an illegal order to fuck off. Including the president. You are absolutely not protected just because a superior gave you an order.
It’s a good thing that there is no history of soldiers obeying illegal orders and committing atrocities. Of course, there are plenty of people in the military who are quite happy obeying those orders because they agree with them.
And luckily they didn’t purge military leadership that’s actually loyal to the constitution, and then use Republican congressional obstruction to prevent promotions for 4 years so Trump could install loyalists…
As much as we like to assume soldiers will follow orders and doctrine as if they were computers running code…they are ultimately human beings with their own free will, reasoning, biases, and agendas, to hell with what is and isn’t legal and proper on paper. It would be a crossroads for the country and everyone who serves.
One of the oldest rules of quelling rebellion is to not use the local soldiers to do it. Too much emotional attachment. Bring in an outside force, preferably ones with standing ethnic or political hatred for those you want to crush.