2yrs ago I literally just said “you look nice, and it’s cold out so good for you putting in the effort” as I was walking the opposite direction as a strange woman. DO NOT DO THAT, recognize for yourself that they are there, but do not acknowledge people. She threw a hissy fit and tried to make it look like I was harassing her, her fat but much nicer friend whom I also complimented took it well and said “it is cold”, the pretty bitch literally started walking like a dinosaur and had a meltdown because I just left. You don’t need these people. Just act like they are an annoyance to even be in your presence and get a dog or two. It’s better that way, permanently.
well i’ve made the experience that people who could be considered “pretty” by social beauty standards are more likely to be mean.
the way i explain it is through the “ideal bonding distance” theory. in chemistry, if you have two atoms forming a molecule, they typically keep a certain distance from one another. In society, something similar is happening. People like to have a certain distance from one another. If it’s too big, they’ll try to get closer to other people. If it’s too close, they try to push other people away. Since “pretty” people make the experience a lot that other people try to come way to close to them (for their own liking), they develop a habit of, in general, pushing people away, thus the mean appearance. People who don’t build that habit (because they don’t need it), are nicer in general, i would say.
I don’t think your analogy really works, its overly complex.
You’re basically describing the concept of people being in, or out, of another person’s ‘league’, the idea that social dynamics can become unbalanced when there is a wide disparity in percieved attractiveness between members of a group, or relationship, which is more pronounced the more people judge/evaluate others more heavily by outward appearance.
…but, it is an empircally validated fact that people who are percieved as more beautiful get more leeway in social interactions, have an easier time being hired, are used to receiving more praise, have an easier time manipulating others, have anneasier time making friends, are more likely to be forgiven or punished less for an offense than people who are percieved as unattractive.
Being pretty doesn’t just directly cause narcissism at some kind of purely deterministic, genetic level, but the way that society treats prettier people encourages them to become narcissistic.
But also, unattractive people who are narcissistic, manipulative and mean often figure out that prettier people have pretty privelege, and will focus on making themselves appear prettier, so as to have an easier time being narcissistic, manipulative and mean.
There are pretty people who aren’t mean, but yes, in general, prettier people are more likely to be mean.
so because pretty women get harassed more, you’re calling them mean? why is this about the woman’s personality and not the jerk you’re replying to who creeped her out and put her in the defense? “mean”… she sounds tough to me
Uh, I wouldn’t comment on passing strangers like that, especially not wording it like “so good for you putting in the effort.” The issue of randomly bringing up their appearance aside, it sounds condescending.
That is not very good advice for the described situation of randomly walking past someone you don’t know and trying to compliment them.
‘Hi’ is a greeting, not a compliment, and using it as a compliment in the described scenario would likely be even more awkward and intimidating than ‘You look nice…’
A greeting implies a response to that greeting and probably a conversation following that is expected.
So now, the girl/woman is going to either outright think, or subconsciously run through:
‘who is this person?’
‘do i know this person?’
‘why do they want to talk to me?’
‘what are their intentions?’
…in the span of a single word.
This is terrible advice for the described situation, far more likely to illicit fear and panic than what gandalf described his attempt at a compliment illiciting.
well tbf the situation is complicated and i can easily see how somebody who has autism can easily run into difficult situations here.
part of the phenomenon is that the societal rules are never really laid out clearly, it seems to me. consider: women dress prettily because they like to. if you notice it, though, you are an asshole. compare that to a different situation: somebody plays violin, and you notice their violin, and ask them “hey, nice violin you got there. do you practice a lot?” and it would be considered normal interaction, if you’re meeting them at a bus station or sth (at least in the country that i live in; that, too, differs from place to place). so, where is the difference?
the difference is that our society has a weird relationship to human bodies. on the one hand, people cannot live without one. on the other hand, society seems to have an outright schizophrenic relationship to the human body. talk about it and you’re a weirdo, no matter what you say. it’s called “objectifying”, even though people seem to have no problem talking about how good somebody did in a sports competition, even though that is completely objectifying as well (after all, your muscles are objects, aren’t they?). so, where’s the difference?
Relentless heckling is a thing, so it’s understandable that this is a touchy subject.
Appearance is also more tied to a person’s perception in society. It’s like telling someone “Hey, you look wealthy today! Good job making money!” Not like commenting on a casual hobby.
Even taking the violin or sports example, wording it like “good on you for putting in the effort” would still sound very condescending.
Oops you fucked up a social interaction and converted your own fuck up to misogyny instead. Don’t do that. You’ll continue to fuck it up and forever reinforce your own downward spiral to misogyny.
Probably next time just say ‘Hey, nice dress!’ or ‘You look stunning!’ and then just keep walking on.
‘You look nice’, in that context, a fleeting interaction, walking past a group of people you don’t know, who don’t know you, is creepy.
Its like the stereotypical creepy guy thing to say.
Following it up with a lengthy explanation and getting the whole group involved is even worse.
‘Good on you for putting in the effort’ is infantilizing, and implies that they normally don’t.
I agree that throwing a hissy fit and stomping away is an immature, rude overreaction, but you did actually stop and continue the interaction with her friend, thus basically from her perspective being awkward, then insulting, then starting an argument, when her and her friend were presumably… going somewhere, to do something, probably within a specific time frame.
You easily could have just kept walking (which ironically is the actual advice you end with), instead of trying to defend yourself… and you’ve got to be a bit more competent in formulating a succinct, quick compliment when the context is ‘randomly walking past a complete stranger.’
Nah, its ok to quickly compliment random people if you do it tactfully and respectfully, without expecting any reciprocation or expanding follow up conversation.
I do this fairly frequently to random people I walk past, and they very often explicitly thank me for it, or fire back with a compliment of myself, or at least say something generally kind or positive in response.
Then we both just go about our day.
This only doesn’t go well with extremely paranoid people, or people who are so emotionally traumitized or insecure/low self esteem that they interperet a genuine compliment as an attack or demand.
the problem was in the compliment being poorly formed, and then basically trapping the girl/woman into a conversation she didn’t want to have, which is a demand.
The idea of trying to compliment a random passerby is not inherently bad, sumguy’s execution was just very poor.
btw, why is “You look stunning!” acceptable, but “You look nice” is not?
Is it because “you look stunning” is euphoric, sales-like, energizing, while “you look nice” is … flat?
why do we have to live in a society that dictates that everything must constantly seem better than it is, instead of just keeping things nice and honest?
Unfortunately, I can’t give you an answer that makes sense, in the way that solving a simple math equation follows well defined rules and just does have a correct solution.
This is a social / psychological kind of question, and if you try to break it down to a mechanistic way of understanding it, well, good luck, a single human brain has almost as many neurons as there are stars in the Milky Way, and they all operate on heuristics and fuzzy logic.
Maybe think of it as … ‘stunning’ is a +5 modifier to ‘You look ___’, whereas ‘nice’ is only +1, and you gotta roll at least a 4.
As to your last question:
You’re not wrong to ask that, but you are overgeneralizing to jump to it straight from ‘why do some compliments often work while others often don’t?’
Part of the point of a compliment is to make someone feel like they are indeed better than most others.
hey i remember you from an earlier discussion that we had :) good to see you again.
yeah, i guess that “and you gotta roll at least a 4” kinda makes sense.
Part of the point of a compliment is to make someone feel like they are indeed better than most others.
I guess that is the point where my personal emotions just differ from the people around me. To me, it is ok to be average, and to be one of many. I don’t want to be special, so i project that feeling onto others. That is why “you look nice” is an acceptable thing to me, but apparently not so much to others.
Not sure if you outright stated you are autistic in other comments, but I’m autistic as well, I’m guessing I just have more experience with it than you, as I’m 35, and I’m guessing you are younger than that.
Socializing with NTs, and even other NDs can be quite difficult and complicated… a whole lot of people will tell you ‘bro, everyone interprets things exactly like I do’… even though their own interpretations are inconsistent, and they are obviously wrong, different people interperet the same phrase, in the same context differently.
The best you can do is trial and error or learn from gathering lots of data, and try to make some general rules that work most of the time.
Anyone who tells you ‘this will work 100% of the time to ensure great social interactions’ is lying… people are different, their moods change, and social norms change over time.
Human psychology is very complicated. It is an academic field that can be studied… but a whole lot of people just hear and see pop psychology tidbits on apps like tiktok, and end up wildly misusing terms.
This has actually been studied, and aomething like 50% of relationship advice and psychological info on tiktok is just flat out wrong, and about 25% of it is dangerously, greivously wrong.
But anyway, its good that you doing some self reflection is leading you to greater understanding of yourself!
Unironically, if you can afford it, a therapist may be able to help you by directing and advising you in that process of becoming more aware of aspects of yourself, and how they differ from others.
I personally agree with you that being average is fine… but again, the point of a compliment is to make someone feel better than average, to highlight something that makes them execptional.
The reason ‘you look nice’ evoked a negative reaponse is that its indicative, to most people, of a compliment that is not really sincere… it isn’t specific, it isn’t emphatic or strong… most people will conclude that a vague, weak compliment is actually just a person who doesn’t really think there’s anything special about a person, but they want to appear as if they think the person is special.
The weak and vague compliment then backfires and evokes the opposite result because it indicates the complimenter is being duplicitous, disingenuous.
Also as a final note, your last msg in this chain used ‘euphoric’ when I think you meant emphatic.
Euphoric, euphoria, is a sense of overwhelming happiness, joy and/or pleasure… its a state of being of a human or conscious subject.
I don’t think a phrase can be euphoric… it can maybe evoke euphoria, but it can’t be euphoric.
Emphatic, on the other hand, basically means strong or severe, more intense or charged with emotion, of a higher degree, unambiguous.
So… nice, good, great, wonderful, stunning, amazing, incredible, impeccable, flawless, iconic… at least for me, that’s roughly in order of rising ‘strength’, as an end to the phrase “You look ___”… but other people may order that list differently.
2yrs ago I literally just said “you look nice, and it’s cold out so good for you putting in the effort” as I was walking the opposite direction as a strange woman. DO NOT DO THAT, recognize for yourself that they are there, but do not acknowledge people. She threw a hissy fit and tried to make it look like I was harassing her, her fat but much nicer friend whom I also complimented took it well and said “it is cold”, the pretty bitch literally started walking like a dinosaur and had a meltdown because I just left. You don’t need these people. Just act like they are an annoyance to even be in your presence and get a dog or two. It’s better that way, permanently.
well i’ve made the experience that people who could be considered “pretty” by social beauty standards are more likely to be mean.
the way i explain it is through the “ideal bonding distance” theory. in chemistry, if you have two atoms forming a molecule, they typically keep a certain distance from one another. In society, something similar is happening. People like to have a certain distance from one another. If it’s too big, they’ll try to get closer to other people. If it’s too close, they try to push other people away. Since “pretty” people make the experience a lot that other people try to come way to close to them (for their own liking), they develop a habit of, in general, pushing people away, thus the mean appearance. People who don’t build that habit (because they don’t need it), are nicer in general, i would say.
I don’t think your analogy really works, its overly complex.
You’re basically describing the concept of people being in, or out, of another person’s ‘league’, the idea that social dynamics can become unbalanced when there is a wide disparity in percieved attractiveness between members of a group, or relationship, which is more pronounced the more people judge/evaluate others more heavily by outward appearance.
…but, it is an empircally validated fact that people who are percieved as more beautiful get more leeway in social interactions, have an easier time being hired, are used to receiving more praise, have an easier time manipulating others, have anneasier time making friends, are more likely to be forgiven or punished less for an offense than people who are percieved as unattractive.
Being pretty doesn’t just directly cause narcissism at some kind of purely deterministic, genetic level, but the way that society treats prettier people encourages them to become narcissistic.
But also, unattractive people who are narcissistic, manipulative and mean often figure out that prettier people have pretty privelege, and will focus on making themselves appear prettier, so as to have an easier time being narcissistic, manipulative and mean.
There are pretty people who aren’t mean, but yes, in general, prettier people are more likely to be mean.
that’s what i meant, thanks for formulating it so clearly
so because pretty women get harassed more, you’re calling them mean? why is this about the woman’s personality and not the jerk you’re replying to who creeped her out and put her in the defense? “mean”… she sounds tough to me
Uh, I wouldn’t comment on passing strangers like that, especially not wording it like “so good for you putting in the effort.” The issue of randomly bringing up their appearance aside, it sounds condescending.
Like… just say hi.
That is not very good advice for the described situation of randomly walking past someone you don’t know and trying to compliment them.
‘Hi’ is a greeting, not a compliment, and using it as a compliment in the described scenario would likely be even more awkward and intimidating than ‘You look nice…’
A greeting implies a response to that greeting and probably a conversation following that is expected.
So now, the girl/woman is going to either outright think, or subconsciously run through:
‘who is this person?’
‘do i know this person?’
‘why do they want to talk to me?’
‘what are their intentions?’
…in the span of a single word.
This is terrible advice for the described situation, far more likely to illicit fear and panic than what gandalf described his attempt at a compliment illiciting.
Ugh, you know what I mean, just like nod or something if it feels appropriate. It doesn’t have to be “hi” the form of “lets start a conversation.”
well tbf the situation is complicated and i can easily see how somebody who has autism can easily run into difficult situations here.
part of the phenomenon is that the societal rules are never really laid out clearly, it seems to me. consider: women dress prettily because they like to. if you notice it, though, you are an asshole. compare that to a different situation: somebody plays violin, and you notice their violin, and ask them “hey, nice violin you got there. do you practice a lot?” and it would be considered normal interaction, if you’re meeting them at a bus station or sth (at least in the country that i live in; that, too, differs from place to place). so, where is the difference?
the difference is that our society has a weird relationship to human bodies. on the one hand, people cannot live without one. on the other hand, society seems to have an outright schizophrenic relationship to the human body. talk about it and you’re a weirdo, no matter what you say. it’s called “objectifying”, even though people seem to have no problem talking about how good somebody did in a sports competition, even though that is completely objectifying as well (after all, your muscles are objects, aren’t they?). so, where’s the difference?
Uh, I feel like you are missing a ton of context.
Relentless heckling is a thing, so it’s understandable that this is a touchy subject.
Appearance is also more tied to a person’s perception in society. It’s like telling someone “Hey, you look wealthy today! Good job making money!” Not like commenting on a casual hobby.
Even taking the violin or sports example, wording it like “good on you for putting in the effort” would still sound very condescending.
Oops you fucked up a social interaction and converted your own fuck up to misogyny instead. Don’t do that. You’ll continue to fuck it up and forever reinforce your own downward spiral to misogyny.
This is why women choose the bear
Talking = death by bear
got it
Probably next time just say ‘Hey, nice dress!’ or ‘You look stunning!’ and then just keep walking on.
‘You look nice’, in that context, a fleeting interaction, walking past a group of people you don’t know, who don’t know you, is creepy.
Its like the stereotypical creepy guy thing to say.
Following it up with a lengthy explanation and getting the whole group involved is even worse.
‘Good on you for putting in the effort’ is infantilizing, and implies that they normally don’t.
I agree that throwing a hissy fit and stomping away is an immature, rude overreaction, but you did actually stop and continue the interaction with her friend, thus basically from her perspective being awkward, then insulting, then starting an argument, when her and her friend were presumably… going somewhere, to do something, probably within a specific time frame.
You easily could have just kept walking (which ironically is the actual advice you end with), instead of trying to defend yourself… and you’ve got to be a bit more competent in formulating a succinct, quick compliment when the context is ‘randomly walking past a complete stranger.’
how about saying none of that shit???
Nah, its ok to quickly compliment random people if you do it tactfully and respectfully, without expecting any reciprocation or expanding follow up conversation.
I do this fairly frequently to random people I walk past, and they very often explicitly thank me for it, or fire back with a compliment of myself, or at least say something generally kind or positive in response.
Then we both just go about our day.
This only doesn’t go well with extremely paranoid people, or people who are so emotionally traumitized or insecure/low self esteem that they interperet a genuine compliment as an attack or demand.
the problem was in the compliment being poorly formed, and then basically trapping the girl/woman into a conversation she didn’t want to have, which is a demand.
The idea of trying to compliment a random passerby is not inherently bad, sumguy’s execution was just very poor.
btw, why is “You look stunning!” acceptable, but “You look nice” is not?
Is it because “you look stunning” is euphoric, sales-like, energizing, while “you look nice” is … flat?
why do we have to live in a society that dictates that everything must constantly seem better than it is, instead of just keeping things nice and honest?
Unfortunately, I can’t give you an answer that makes sense, in the way that solving a simple math equation follows well defined rules and just does have a correct solution.
This is a social / psychological kind of question, and if you try to break it down to a mechanistic way of understanding it, well, good luck, a single human brain has almost as many neurons as there are stars in the Milky Way, and they all operate on heuristics and fuzzy logic.
Maybe think of it as … ‘stunning’ is a +5 modifier to ‘You look ___’, whereas ‘nice’ is only +1, and you gotta roll at least a 4.
As to your last question:
You’re not wrong to ask that, but you are overgeneralizing to jump to it straight from ‘why do some compliments often work while others often don’t?’
Part of the point of a compliment is to make someone feel like they are indeed better than most others.
hey i remember you from an earlier discussion that we had :) good to see you again.
yeah, i guess that “and you gotta roll at least a 4” kinda makes sense.
I guess that is the point where my personal emotions just differ from the people around me. To me, it is ok to be average, and to be one of many. I don’t want to be special, so i project that feeling onto others. That is why “you look nice” is an acceptable thing to me, but apparently not so much to others.
Good to see you too =)
Not sure if you outright stated you are autistic in other comments, but I’m autistic as well, I’m guessing I just have more experience with it than you, as I’m 35, and I’m guessing you are younger than that.
Socializing with NTs, and even other NDs can be quite difficult and complicated… a whole lot of people will tell you ‘bro, everyone interprets things exactly like I do’… even though their own interpretations are inconsistent, and they are obviously wrong, different people interperet the same phrase, in the same context differently.
The best you can do is trial and error or learn from gathering lots of data, and try to make some general rules that work most of the time.
Anyone who tells you ‘this will work 100% of the time to ensure great social interactions’ is lying… people are different, their moods change, and social norms change over time.
Human psychology is very complicated. It is an academic field that can be studied… but a whole lot of people just hear and see pop psychology tidbits on apps like tiktok, and end up wildly misusing terms.
This has actually been studied, and aomething like 50% of relationship advice and psychological info on tiktok is just flat out wrong, and about 25% of it is dangerously, greivously wrong.
But anyway, its good that you doing some self reflection is leading you to greater understanding of yourself!
Unironically, if you can afford it, a therapist may be able to help you by directing and advising you in that process of becoming more aware of aspects of yourself, and how they differ from others.
I personally agree with you that being average is fine… but again, the point of a compliment is to make someone feel better than average, to highlight something that makes them execptional.
The reason ‘you look nice’ evoked a negative reaponse is that its indicative, to most people, of a compliment that is not really sincere… it isn’t specific, it isn’t emphatic or strong… most people will conclude that a vague, weak compliment is actually just a person who doesn’t really think there’s anything special about a person, but they want to appear as if they think the person is special.
The weak and vague compliment then backfires and evokes the opposite result because it indicates the complimenter is being duplicitous, disingenuous.
Also as a final note, your last msg in this chain used ‘euphoric’ when I think you meant emphatic.
Euphoric, euphoria, is a sense of overwhelming happiness, joy and/or pleasure… its a state of being of a human or conscious subject.
I don’t think a phrase can be euphoric… it can maybe evoke euphoria, but it can’t be euphoric.
Emphatic, on the other hand, basically means strong or severe, more intense or charged with emotion, of a higher degree, unambiguous.
So… nice, good, great, wonderful, stunning, amazing, incredible, impeccable, flawless, iconic… at least for me, that’s roughly in order of rising ‘strength’, as an end to the phrase “You look ___”… but other people may order that list differently.
Sorry pal but you were in the wrong here.
What?
weird and creepy, but okay
okay, you’re lucky you kept your intact nose that day
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