Telegram by default does not send end-to-end encrypted messages (only in secret chats) and thus can be considered very unsafe as the server owner can literally read all your messages.
They give the user the impression that they are similar secure to e2e encrypted messengers but really are not since most users just start a normal chat.
This also means that, in theory, surveillance is very possible and likely as the russians are not really to be trusted by anyone. Privacy nightmare.
IIRC the reason they don’t do e2e encryption is because you can access the information from the desktop without having access to the phone, you cannot do that with whatsapp, every desktop connection must pass through the phone, and that’s mighty annoying.
Yeah, you need to trust them that they will save the data in their servers in a secure way, but they have not betrayed the users’ trust since they are running, and several people trust them.
Well, the fact that telegram normal/group chats are not encrypted is not true either. I think I know how is signal doing it, and I wish telegram upgraded it’s services, but for now it’s without any kind of doubt the most seamless chat service I have ever used, with the integrations, stickers and all that. I’ll give signal a try though, GL moving all the friend group chats though.
Well, for starters, Signal doesn’t have a web version so I cannot use it in managed pcs, bummer. In any case, I’ll check it out but I highl doubt that the user experience will be even close.
Lmao it’s not. It doesn’t have nearly the same stickers, no animated stickers, no reactions, no instant video messages.
Encryption is not part of the user experience, that’s an underlying security messure that he user doesn’t feel. It’s important but it’s not part of the user experience.
Even though not e2e, standard chat messages are still encrypted in their servers. There will always be more private ways to communicate if you are paranoid about that but for a regular user like myself and many others, Telegram offers much more than you could ask, and is not affiliated with big tech.
Telegram by default does not send end-to-end encrypted messages (only in secret chats)
When I tap the new message icon in the lower right corner, Telegram asks me which type of message I want to send. There is no default there. Maybe other clients do it differently from the main Android client but here there is no default.
WhatsApp by default backs up to Google drive, which is laughably insecure.
I don’t know how good is WhatsApp’s e2e implementation, I’ve heard good things about protocol though. But I do know Telegram protocol documentation contains all information needed to implement e2e capable Telegram client, and their e2e is really good, I’ve seen it done by my friend and as I’m a programmer and am interested in cryptography, I followed his work very closely.
I still do not trust e2e group chats, it’s a shaky point in security protocols. There was some kerfuffle about WhatsApp being able to silently add invisible listeners to group chats, wasn’t there?
Telegram very explicitly chooses the right amount of security and makes user aware of inconveniences this level of security brings along. WhatsApp lies in user’s face, making you think it’s secure and convenient.
edit: btw I’m Telegram premium subscriber and love it. I subscribed for the ability to convert voice messages into text. I am aware of privacy concerns, voice messages get sent to some 3rd party for this to work. Pretty often this speech-to-text works not very good, I expect it’s much better for English language though. I still love my Telegram premium, for being able to support developer and to lower the chance of being the product. Cost is negligible, benefits are tangible.
Every service has a product they sell, if a service is free — you are the product.
Need I remind you WhatsApp is owned by Meta? Free service from creators of Facebook and our mutual respect to their privacy practices, all in the same sentence, yeah.
Telegram by default does not send end-to-end encrypted messages (only in secret chats) and thus can be considered very unsafe as the server owner can literally read all your messages.
They give the user the impression that they are similar secure to e2e encrypted messengers but really are not since most users just start a normal chat.
This also means that, in theory, surveillance is very possible and likely as the russians are not really to be trusted by anyone. Privacy nightmare.
Telegram is owned by a person born in Russia, but has long moved out and lives in
GermanyDubai, where Telegram’s HQ is locatedTelegram is located in Dubai, where did you read about Germany?
I swear I remeber reading Germany. I searched it, yes its in Dubai
Use to be in Berlin
Oh alright, maybe I just had outdated information.
IIRC the reason they don’t do e2e encryption is because you can access the information from the desktop without having access to the phone, you cannot do that with whatsapp, every desktop connection must pass through the phone, and that’s mighty annoying.
Yeah, you need to trust them that they will save the data in their servers in a secure way, but they have not betrayed the users’ trust since they are running, and several people trust them.
Not true. You can do that with Signal.
Well, the fact that telegram normal/group chats are not encrypted is not true either. I think I know how is signal doing it, and I wish telegram upgraded it’s services, but for now it’s without any kind of doubt the most seamless chat service I have ever used, with the integrations, stickers and all that. I’ll give signal a try though, GL moving all the friend group chats though.
> Well, the fact that telegram normal/group chats are not encrypted is not true either.
It’s not encrypted in any way that actually matters.
> it’s without any kind of doubt the most seamless chat service I have ever used, with the integrations, stickers and all that.
Yeah stickers are not high up on my list of priorities.
Well, for starters, Signal doesn’t have a web version so I cannot use it in managed pcs, bummer. In any case, I’ll check it out but I highl doubt that the user experience will be even close.
It’s not close. Signal is way better.
Lmao it’s not. It doesn’t have nearly the same stickers, no animated stickers, no reactions, no instant video messages.
Encryption is not part of the user experience, that’s an underlying security messure that he user doesn’t feel. It’s important but it’s not part of the user experience.
Even though not e2e, standard chat messages are still encrypted in their servers. There will always be more private ways to communicate if you are paranoid about that but for a regular user like myself and many others, Telegram offers much more than you could ask, and is not affiliated with big tech.
When I tap the new message icon in the lower right corner, Telegram asks me which type of message I want to send. There is no default there. Maybe other clients do it differently from the main Android client but here there is no default.
WhatsApp by default backs up to Google drive, which is laughably insecure.
I don’t know how good is WhatsApp’s e2e implementation, I’ve heard good things about protocol though. But I do know Telegram protocol documentation contains all information needed to implement e2e capable Telegram client, and their e2e is really good, I’ve seen it done by my friend and as I’m a programmer and am interested in cryptography, I followed his work very closely.
I still do not trust e2e group chats, it’s a shaky point in security protocols. There was some kerfuffle about WhatsApp being able to silently add invisible listeners to group chats, wasn’t there?
Telegram very explicitly chooses the right amount of security and makes user aware of inconveniences this level of security brings along. WhatsApp lies in user’s face, making you think it’s secure and convenient.
edit: btw I’m Telegram premium subscriber and love it. I subscribed for the ability to convert voice messages into text. I am aware of privacy concerns, voice messages get sent to some 3rd party for this to work. Pretty often this speech-to-text works not very good, I expect it’s much better for English language though. I still love my Telegram premium, for being able to support developer and to lower the chance of being the product. Cost is negligible, benefits are tangible.
Every service has a product they sell, if a service is free — you are the product.
Need I remind you WhatsApp is owned by Meta? Free service from creators of Facebook and our mutual respect to their privacy practices, all in the same sentence, yeah.