Trump. You are supporting Trump. Trump will ban Muslims again and not just the foreign ones.
Biden is not the one murdering Palestinians.
Bebe is.
Bebe and Trump are buddies. Bebe spoke directly to Congress to humiliate Obama to help Trump get elected. He chose sides and interfered in the US election. Because Bebe is a racist genocidal murderer.
Sometimes Presidents have to do difficult diplomacy. And it sucks.
But Trump is coming for all Muslims. Seriously. We cannot have Trump again.
An American election is a zero sum game. You are forced to pick the least crappy option.
The election is important BUT the president isn’t and shouldn’t be above criticism. He is not doing the killing but he’s keeping the killers well stocked with weapons and ammunition, doing PR for them and undermining any attempt to stop the killing.
If this isn’t something he should be criticised for I don’t know what is
People too stupid to understand how politics work would rather just insult everyone who doesn’t hold the exact same narrow ignorant view that allows them to virtue signal.
They’re a huge difference between criticizing, and refusing to vote for him over a single issue. Criticize him all you wish, he’s certainly earned it, but crossing one’s arms and staying home instead of voting as a result of said criticism is fucking stupid.
Genocide is a pretty big issue as far as it goes though. Wouldn’t say it was “fucking stupid” - what if you have family in Gaza? What if one of them died?
I think you’d still have to vote Biden (first past the post fucking sucks) but if you didn’t, it’s on Biden for not changing his approach in the face of criticism from both voters and his own party. That is how democracy is supposed to work.
Biden hasn’t committed genocide. And the fact that you think he has- or even has the authority to do so in another country he has no authority over- illustrates my point:
You kids serially need a new bit. Because this one is exhausting for myself and everyone else to try and correct. It’s fundamentally wrong on every level.
I’m going to go ahead block you now as I have with all the other nonsense spewing tankie because I can see from just this one comment of yours that you will not add anything of value to add to any discussion I might find myself in.
Biden hasn’t committed genocide. And the fact that you think he has- or even has the authority to do so in another country he has no authority over- illustrates my point:
Well I don’t think he has soooo? Literally read the first comment you responded to.
He bypassed congress to get them weapons to continue the killing and the US vetoed a cease fire resolution. This is not “you kids and your tiktok talking points” as much as “well known pieces of news that paint a clear picture of complicity in what is being seriously investigated by the ICJ as a case of genocide.”
I’m going to go ahead block you now as I have with all the other nonsense spewing tankie because I can see from just this one comment of yours that you will not add anything of value to add to any discussion I might find myself in.
Lol I am a tankie now apparently despite being an anti-authoritarian leftist. I’m sure you’ll be way more informed if you block any opinion outside of your bubble. Absolutely delusional
And were Biden stupid enough to cut aid to Israel he’d lose two to three times as many potential Votes as there are to gain from cutting off aid. But you don’t care about that as purity is the only concern and consequences are for others to pay.
It’s not about purity you donut. It’s about the fact that we’re witnessing a fucking genocide with our own eyes and instead of being outraged by it and calling for an immediate stop, you’re weighing political election outcomes.
Yes exactly. Seriously I get the need for tactical voting, but this is embarrassing. Anybody criticises the president of the United States for supporting a fucking genocide and we get a lecture about Trump and how we’re going to spoil the election. Believe it or not some things are more important and Biden is failing in his duty as a president and a human being.
Should you still vote for him? Yes, obviously.
Does that mean we have to just stay quiet while he supports war crimes and much worse? Why the fuck should we
The polling shows around 50/50 support toward Israel, and the separation is generational. Quite succintly, Biden is in a pickle. Unconditional support toward Israel could also cost him the election. I’d argue this can be used as a wedge issue against the Democratic Party.
Polling shows about 50% of Democratic voters view Israel’s invasion of Gaza as a genocide, and 30% aren’t sure yet, with only 20% viewing it as not a genocide.
Biden’s actions don’t reflect the vast majority of Democratic voters.
But let’s not pretend this coverage doesn’t have an impact on certain voters who throw their hands up and go, “ah hell they’re all the same! I’m not voting!”
Right-wing operatives are already obviously seizing on this wedge-driving opportunity.
Just equals supporting his bid for power. And in turn supporting lil’ dic. pootie and fash baby bibi as they are who gain should you succeed in bringing Biden down.
The US is funding and providing the weapons to kill Palestinians, resources Biden can withhold if he chooses to. Biden may not be pulling the trigger any more than Netanyahu is, but he is responsible for their deaths, and should be held accountable
Congress controls foreign aid. It’s usually bundled such that it’s part of a larger funding bill. There’s very little Biden can do without opening a can of worms.
That is incorrect the foreign military financing program authorizes the president to finance procurement of defense articles and services for foreign countries and international organizations. Israel’s $11 million per day welfare check and the arms they are provided is at the purview of the president. It’s the exact same tactic that Ronald Reagan used in 1982 to stop Israel carpet bombing Lebanon. He threatened to pull back all monetary and weapons aid from the US, the bombing stopped.
Congress only controls foreign aid when it’s initially approved. After it’s approved, it’s at the president’s discretion if that funding gets cut
However the problem with it is that the tankies here don’t care. It’s cool now for them to hate on Biden and be outraged about things happening in a country they couldn’t have point to on a map six months ago. Too many people have tried reasoning with them and explaining the fist past the post way things work-
How did you feel about Palestinians back in September? Oh you never once thought or cared about them before that?
Funny how the news told you what to be mad about, and what to call a conflict.
You should also complain to all the Arab country leaders who look at Palestinians as human refuse and have refused to help them for decades? Or are you satisfied using talking points from Saudi billionaires?
Why do you feel you have to switch the topic to: A) accusing me personally not to care about Palestinians before Oct, B) Arab should do more.
These two points have different discussion not related to Biden direct aid of Israel for no reason and voting choices.
By the way your points A is stubid and point B is useless since clearly you have no understanding of Arab x Israel history and UK, US support for Israel.
The thing with Muslims and Arabs is that they hate each other just as much as they hate Israel. Some of the worst things I’ve heard said about Palestinians was from Egyptians and other Arabs, they look at them like they’re human garbage. But they’re loving this, because they can now openly attack Israel, which is something they love to unify to do.
Why weren’t all these Arab nations helping Palestinians before? Even now they won’t take Palestinian refugees.
This is all grandstanding, they don’t actually care about or even like Palestine
you are probably looking at it like this conflict started just last year.
its been going since the 40s on and off. ever since the nakba, last i checked, estimates range from a little less than a million to a couple million. theres a reason for palestine’s young demographic today.
Haha. Not sure why you’re being downvoted, he’s not even running a campaign. But somehow in the end this will be the progressives fault. Suck a dick dems.
Eisenhower led multiple armies totaling in the millions in the largest war in human history. Cornel West has a background in *checks notes philosophizing.
Abraham Lincoln served as member of the Illinois House of Representatives from 1 December 1834 until 4 December 1842, representing Sangamon County. He went on to serve in to United States House of Representatives for Illinois’ seventh district from 4 March 1847 to 3 March 1849. His time in between was spent practicing law. I know you’re just trying to be disingenuous, but please stop.
Muslims and Republicans have more in common than they like to admit. So they won’t find 4 years of Trump a big problem. Especially the ones that live in the big Muslim communities that aren’t facing much discrimination.
That’s not true. Muslims agree with Republicans on LGBT rights and similar things, but that’s about it. There’s a reason Michigan Arabs tend to vote Democrat and speaking as a Muslim that’s probably because Republican nonsense like “being poor is personal responsibility and nobody has any responsibility to help you” doesn’t resonate with Muslims.
Abortion, abstinence, women’s subservience. American Arabs vote democrat because the republicans would be happy if they were dead.
But if you asked a practicing Muslim and a republican for their views on a wide range of issues except which god you worship, you’ll find there are many more similarities than you are suggesting.
Famous for their distributing the wealth to people who need it, the UAE, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar are positively wonderful places for the working class 🙄
Famous for their distributing the wealth to people who need it, the UAE, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar are positively wonderful places for the working class 🙄
I mean those countries aren’t the shining examples of Islam at work so yeah. Gulf countries are like famous for this.
We had a leader the west didn’t like so they backed a coup that put in a corrupt dictator that they liked
We had a leader the soviets didn’t like so they backed a coup that put a corrupt dictator in charge that they liked
The country came out of a coup and installed a popular leader that didn’t want to play ball with the west for various reasons, so the west sanctioned the country until its economy barely functioned
A colony was given an independence “deal” that forces them to adopt their former colonizers currency, put about half of their reserves in said former colonizers bank, and forced the newly “independent” country to sell the extraction of its natural resources to companies from the former colonizer at disgustingly cheap prices, so what should be a rich country is still poor and the officials of this former colony are bribed by the colonizers to keep the system going.
The wealthy oil nations used their wealth to give their citizens an extremely good standard of living however either as a result of this or of other reasons (possibly related to culture but thats a different conversation), no one wanted to do menial labor so here comes the importation of cheap foreign labor
King Faisal Abdul-Aziz was a descent leader that tried to unite the middle east but he was assassinated.
And Islam allows abortion with different kinds of restrictions depending on your school of thought
Most are dictatorships so the attitude of the government doesn’t reflect much except how greedy the elites are, but charity is big in Muslim countries. The whole “pull yourself up by your bootstraps and if you rely on others you’re a leech” attitude doesn’t really resonate with Muslims.
That said, if I had to raise an example I’d probably pick Tunisia. Not that they don’t have wealth inequality or poverty, but they’re doing decently well for themselves and have a government that’s actually trying to fix these things.
Also almost all of the non-Gulf Arab world has significant social welfare to my knowledge.
Trump. You are supporting Trump. Trump will ban Muslims again and not just the foreign ones.
Biden is not the one murdering Palestinians.
Bebe is.
Bebe and Trump are buddies. Bebe spoke directly to Congress to humiliate Obama to help Trump get elected. He chose sides and interfered in the US election. Because Bebe is a racist genocidal murderer.
Sometimes Presidents have to do difficult diplomacy. And it sucks.
But Trump is coming for all Muslims. Seriously. We cannot have Trump again.
An American election is a zero sum game. You are forced to pick the least crappy option.
The election is important BUT the president isn’t and shouldn’t be above criticism. He is not doing the killing but he’s keeping the killers well stocked with weapons and ammunition, doing PR for them and undermining any attempt to stop the killing.
If this isn’t something he should be criticised for I don’t know what is
People who support genocide for its own sake will come up with any excuse to keep their indefensible positions from scrutiny.
People too stupid to understand how politics work would rather just insult everyone who doesn’t hold the exact same narrow ignorant view that allows them to virtue signal.
You certainly are.
They’re a huge difference between criticizing, and refusing to vote for him over a single issue. Criticize him all you wish, he’s certainly earned it, but crossing one’s arms and staying home instead of voting as a result of said criticism is fucking stupid.
Genocide is a pretty big issue as far as it goes though. Wouldn’t say it was “fucking stupid” - what if you have family in Gaza? What if one of them died?
I think you’d still have to vote Biden (first past the post fucking sucks) but if you didn’t, it’s on Biden for not changing his approach in the face of criticism from both voters and his own party. That is how democracy is supposed to work.
Biden hasn’t committed genocide. And the fact that you think he has- or even has the authority to do so in another country he has no authority over- illustrates my point:
You kids serially need a new bit. Because this one is exhausting for myself and everyone else to try and correct. It’s fundamentally wrong on every level.
I’m going to go ahead block you now as I have with all the other nonsense spewing tankie because I can see from just this one comment of yours that you will not add anything of value to add to any discussion I might find myself in.
Well I don’t think he has soooo? Literally read the first comment you responded to.
He bypassed congress to get them weapons to continue the killing and the US vetoed a cease fire resolution. This is not “you kids and your tiktok talking points” as much as “well known pieces of news that paint a clear picture of complicity in what is being seriously investigated by the ICJ as a case of genocide.”
Lol I am a tankie now apparently despite being an anti-authoritarian leftist. I’m sure you’ll be way more informed if you block any opinion outside of your bubble. Absolutely delusional
And were Biden stupid enough to cut aid to Israel he’d lose two to three times as many potential Votes as there are to gain from cutting off aid. But you don’t care about that as purity is the only concern and consequences are for others to pay.
It’s not about purity you donut. It’s about the fact that we’re witnessing a fucking genocide with our own eyes and instead of being outraged by it and calling for an immediate stop, you’re weighing political election outcomes.
Yes exactly. Seriously I get the need for tactical voting, but this is embarrassing. Anybody criticises the president of the United States for supporting a fucking genocide and we get a lecture about Trump and how we’re going to spoil the election. Believe it or not some things are more important and Biden is failing in his duty as a president and a human being.
Should you still vote for him? Yes, obviously.
Does that mean we have to just stay quiet while he supports war crimes and much worse? Why the fuck should we
Because the consequences are more important than a feel good pyrrhic moral victory.
Only if you’re American.
No, the consequences shall be felt around the world. Just as they were the last time idiots decided teaching a lesson was more important.
Biden is a politician. What else should we expect? He’s not a great leader, or a moral paragon, or a persuasive debater. He’s a politician.
So continue the slaughter so he doesn’t lose? I thought liberals claimed they were gonna hold their people accountable
In no way was that posted, but I do understand you wish it were.
Thats exactly what you said. "Who cares that 30k+ Palestinians are dead as long as Biden doesnt lose’
There is no need for you to be accurate as your goal is to sow discord.
Nope, you’re the only one saying that. Claiming the moral high ground doesn’t give you the right to make shit up.
The polling shows around 50/50 support toward Israel, and the separation is generational. Quite succintly, Biden is in a pickle. Unconditional support toward Israel could also cost him the election. I’d argue this can be used as a wedge issue against the Democratic Party.
Polling shows about 50% of Democratic voters view Israel’s invasion of Gaza as a genocide, and 30% aren’t sure yet, with only 20% viewing it as not a genocide.
Biden’s actions don’t reflect the vast majority of Democratic voters.
Not meeting with Biden =/= Voting for Trump
But let’s not pretend this coverage doesn’t have an impact on certain voters who throw their hands up and go, “ah hell they’re all the same! I’m not voting!”
Right-wing operatives are already obviously seizing on this wedge-driving opportunity.
They whine about being called shrubs while they amplify the message Russia bots are also posting.
Just equals supporting his bid for power. And in turn supporting lil’ dic. pootie and fash baby bibi as they are who gain should you succeed in bringing Biden down.
As far as centrists are concerned, anything other than worship of everything Biden does is a vote for Trump.
The US is funding and providing the weapons to kill Palestinians, resources Biden can withhold if he chooses to. Biden may not be pulling the trigger any more than Netanyahu is, but he is responsible for their deaths, and should be held accountable
Congress controls foreign aid. It’s usually bundled such that it’s part of a larger funding bill. There’s very little Biden can do without opening a can of worms.
That is incorrect the foreign military financing program authorizes the president to finance procurement of defense articles and services for foreign countries and international organizations. Israel’s $11 million per day welfare check and the arms they are provided is at the purview of the president. It’s the exact same tactic that Ronald Reagan used in 1982 to stop Israel carpet bombing Lebanon. He threatened to pull back all monetary and weapons aid from the US, the bombing stopped.
Congress only controls foreign aid when it’s initially approved. After it’s approved, it’s at the president’s discretion if that funding gets cut
Perfect reasoning!
However the problem with it is that the tankies here don’t care. It’s cool now for them to hate on Biden and be outraged about things happening in a country they couldn’t have point to on a map six months ago. Too many people have tried reasoning with them and explaining the fist past the post way things work-
They’re just too stubborn.
Here an alternative point of view:
As democrat who cares about the country you should help force your leadership to stop the genocide or stop aid and sale of arms if you want my vote.
How did you feel about Palestinians back in September? Oh you never once thought or cared about them before that?
Funny how the news told you what to be mad about, and what to call a conflict.
You should also complain to all the Arab country leaders who look at Palestinians as human refuse and have refused to help them for decades? Or are you satisfied using talking points from Saudi billionaires?
Oct. 7 explicitly was enacted to, in part, stop the normalization of relations between Saudi Arabi and Israel.
The only person showing how unbelievably ignorant and racist they are here is you.
The billionaires of Saudi Arabia want normalized relations. The people of Saudi Arabia don’t.
Why do you feel you have to switch the topic to: A) accusing me personally not to care about Palestinians before Oct, B) Arab should do more.
These two points have different discussion not related to Biden direct aid of Israel for no reason and voting choices.
By the way your points A is stubid and point B is useless since clearly you have no understanding of Arab x Israel history and UK, US support for Israel.
The thing with Muslims and Arabs is that they hate each other just as much as they hate Israel. Some of the worst things I’ve heard said about Palestinians was from Egyptians and other Arabs, they look at them like they’re human garbage. But they’re loving this, because they can now openly attack Israel, which is something they love to unify to do.
Why weren’t all these Arab nations helping Palestinians before? Even now they won’t take Palestinian refugees.
This is all grandstanding, they don’t actually care about or even like Palestine
So facilitating the murder of millions of muslims is ok, but not letting them enter your country is worse?
give the numbers then.
how many palestinians died, vs how many israelis over the almost century this genocide has been raging on.
thought so.
Well the most recent conflict (which is the context of this post, wrt Biden being involved?) is currently @26k+ Gazans killed
Where did you get the “millions”?
the thread is about who facilitates what.
again, look up the amount dead in this conflict since its inception.
If you’d bother to look up the numbers you’d understand the question where you got the ‘millions’ bit
Where did you get that from?
you are probably looking at it like this conflict started just last year.
its been going since the 40s on and off. ever since the nakba, last i checked, estimates range from a little less than a million to a couple million. theres a reason for palestine’s young demographic today.
Can you tell me where you got these estimates?
deleted by creator
Haha. Not sure why you’re being downvoted, he’s not even running a campaign. But somehow in the end this will be the progressives fault. Suck a dick dems.
the least crappy option is cornel west
No. Cornel West has no experience in public office and the Presidency isn’t the place to learn on the job.
Apparently neither is being VP.
how much experience did Eisenhower have in public office?
your standard is arbitrary and irrational.
Who says I would have supported Eisenhower for office?
I would have voted for Adlai Stevenson in that election.
Eisenhower led multiple armies totaling in the millions in the largest war in human history. Cornel West has a background in *checks notes philosophizing.
Lincoln never held public office. lots of presidents make it their first political job.
edit: whoops. still, my point stands: there is no reason to expect anyone to have experience being president in order to elect them.
Abraham Lincoln served as member of the Illinois House of Representatives from 1 December 1834 until 4 December 1842, representing Sangamon County. He went on to serve in to United States House of Representatives for Illinois’ seventh district from 4 March 1847 to 3 March 1849. His time in between was spent practicing law. I know you’re just trying to be disingenuous, but please stop.
your accusation of disingenuousness is, itself, bad faith
Muslims and Republicans have more in common than they like to admit. So they won’t find 4 years of Trump a big problem. Especially the ones that live in the big Muslim communities that aren’t facing much discrimination.
They agree on a lot of things - but the color of their skin and the god they respectively worship is a real big divide.
For anyone on the outside who doesn’t care which god or skin color, they look practically identical.
That’s not true. Muslims agree with Republicans on LGBT rights and similar things, but that’s about it. There’s a reason Michigan Arabs tend to vote Democrat and speaking as a Muslim that’s probably because Republican nonsense like “being poor is personal responsibility and nobody has any responsibility to help you” doesn’t resonate with Muslims.
Abortion, abstinence, women’s subservience. American Arabs vote democrat because the republicans would be happy if they were dead.
But if you asked a practicing Muslim and a republican for their views on a wide range of issues except which god you worship, you’ll find there are many more similarities than you are suggesting.
Famous for their distributing the wealth to people who need it, the UAE, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar are positively wonderful places for the working class 🙄
I mean those countries aren’t the shining examples of Islam at work so yeah. Gulf countries are like famous for this.
Which countries are shining examples of Islam at work? I’m having a hard time coming up with any that don’t have staggering wealth inequality.
We had a leader the west didn’t like so they backed a coup that put in a corrupt dictator that they liked
We had a leader the soviets didn’t like so they backed a coup that put a corrupt dictator in charge that they liked
The country came out of a coup and installed a popular leader that didn’t want to play ball with the west for various reasons, so the west sanctioned the country until its economy barely functioned
A colony was given an independence “deal” that forces them to adopt their former colonizers currency, put about half of their reserves in said former colonizers bank, and forced the newly “independent” country to sell the extraction of its natural resources to companies from the former colonizer at disgustingly cheap prices, so what should be a rich country is still poor and the officials of this former colony are bribed by the colonizers to keep the system going.
The wealthy oil nations used their wealth to give their citizens an extremely good standard of living however either as a result of this or of other reasons (possibly related to culture but thats a different conversation), no one wanted to do menial labor so here comes the importation of cheap foreign labor
King Faisal Abdul-Aziz was a descent leader that tried to unite the middle east but he was assassinated.
And Islam allows abortion with different kinds of restrictions depending on your school of thought
Is one of those restrictions that the woman, who can’t go anywhere without a male relative, has no say?
Most are dictatorships so the attitude of the government doesn’t reflect much except how greedy the elites are, but charity is big in Muslim countries. The whole “pull yourself up by your bootstraps and if you rely on others you’re a leech” attitude doesn’t really resonate with Muslims.
That said, if I had to raise an example I’d probably pick Tunisia. Not that they don’t have wealth inequality or poverty, but they’re doing decently well for themselves and have a government that’s actually trying to fix these things.
Also almost all of the non-Gulf Arab world has significant social welfare to my knowledge.
Tunisia’s president held a speech against Black African migrants last year which made his people do a genocide on them
Charity is a big talking point for Rs too, they just don’t think the state should do any of it. Lots of them still tithe.
Yup, the 'save the family ’ rallys are hilarious examples of how Right wing assholes can be Christian or Muslim all the same.