• Montagge
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    2 months ago

    Cat’s shouldn’t be putting a dent in the bird population because they shouldn’t be outside. They’re an invasive species that can definitely destroy local ecosystems.

    Yes habitat destruction is reducing bird population, but that doesn’t excuse the irresponsibility of cat owners that let their cats outside. All that accomplished is creating two problems.

    • Socsa@sh.itjust.works
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      2 months ago

      I don’t understand why people are so defensive about this. Study after study shows that cats are fucking terrible for native ecosystems.

      Not just that, outdoor cats live much shorter lives. There is literally no reason to put a cat outside unless you hate your pet and your ecosystem.

      • Montagge
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        2 months ago

        It’s irresponsible and stupid, but my sweet baby would never!

        Or it’s not fair to keep them inside all day! Okay build an enclosure outside they can go into like a responsible owner.

        I don’t even know what all to say to the chucklefuck that thinks it’s fine that the Scottish Wildcat is being bred to extinction. It’s okay though because that’s just evolution.

        Humanity was a fucking mistake

        • Adanisi
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          2 months ago

          I didn’t say it’s fine. I said it’s the only problem when you made the grand claim that domestic cats were basically stealing their food source.

          Because you made it sound like they’re dying, when they’re really just hybridising. Both are forms of extinction in a sense, but one is a lot worse than the other.

          And again, they don’t even live in the same damn parts of the country.

          Americans like you need put in your place and reminded that the whole world does not revolve about you and your country’s circumstances.

          • Montagge
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            2 months ago

            Yes only in America are wild cats threatening native cat’s food sources. At least you’re able to see America from your pedestal.

            • Adanisi
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              2 months ago

              You told me, that the domestic cat must be eating the Scottish Wildcat’s lunch.

              We were specifically talking about that species at that point. Don’t try to spin it.

      • Montagge
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        2 months ago

        Except plastic straws don’t really do anything to accelerate climate change and cats can decimate bird populations

      • MetaCubed@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Except plastic straws aren’t actively hunting marine creatures.

        Domesticated cats are not native to north america and western Europe, and people should be more responsible in how they care for their pets, especially the ones that are invasive fucking species.

        Also, 2 things can be true. It’s possible that bird populations are being decimated by ecological destruction as well as the mass breeding and free roaming of invasive predators introduced by humans.

        Edit: clarified that I meant domesticated cats

        • Adanisi
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          2 months ago

          “Cats are not native to north america and western Europe”

          You’re just wrong, at least about the Europe part. There’s literally a species known as the Scottish Wildcat. And last I checked, Scotland was in western Europe.

          Can Americans stop spreading patently false information based on their Amero-centric worldview? Please and thank you.

          • MetaCubed@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            Fantastically, a wild cat isn’t a domestic cat! Wow! Who knew!

            Stop thinking that things that make you feel bad about your world view are “patently false information based on an amero-centric worldview”. Please and fucking thank you

            • WldFyre@lemm.ee
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              2 months ago

              Facts and sources, better downvote because that doesn’t match my vibes about my outdoor cats lmfao

            • Adanisi
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              2 months ago

              You edited your comment, so don’t get snarky about me not accounting for an edit you made after I replied.

              Anyways,

              I mentioned wildcats because they are similar to domestic cats and the existence of them here disprove the “it’s not their natural habitat” talking point.

              The Scottish Wildcat is so overwhelmingly similar to the domestic cat that they can interbreed.

              And this fact might entertain you: both types of wildcat mentioned are considered Felis Silvestris. They’re really not that different.

              I don’t care about some American publication talking about cats as that is obviously going to be specific to America, and it’s claims of invasiveness do not apply to many other places, or are such a small concern it’s not considered.

              Here’s a UK source, a bit more applicable to where I live:

              http://web.archive.org/web/20200206053916/www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/

              That’s the checks notes Royal Society for the Protection of Birds noting that cats are not causing issues for bird populations. Give it a read.

              • MetaCubed@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                I edited one word of my comment because I had another reply from someone who misunderstood what I was referring to, so i clarified so there wouldnt be further confusion, not to give myself an excuse to be snarky.

                • I’ve read the article you’ve provided a number of times previously and while yes, it does indicate that there is no scientific evidence for my claim, it is limited to the UK.

                • I don’t see what interbreed-ability has to do with invasiveness?

                I don’t care about some American publication talking about cats

                • I provided 3 sources, one was American, the others were from Oxford (also in the UK last I checked) and Tillburg (Netherlands), both discussing the EU broadly

                • Here is another study from the checks notes British Ecological Society which concludes in part

                “…It is also well established that free-ranging cats pose a significant threat to biodiversity conservation and restoration worldwide, and that remedying this threat is relatively easy when compared to other drivers of biodiversity loss…”

                If you’re not going to read the evidence I’m providing, while saying I’m only providing americentric evidence, then I’m going to respectfully abandon this thread. I apologize for the snark, that was uncalled for.

                Edit: formatting only

        • Dogyote@slrpnk.net
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          2 months ago

          Wild Cats Of North America:

          Bobcat

          Canada Lynx

          Puma / Mountain Lion / Cougar

          Ocelot

          Jaguarundi

          Jaguar

          Margay

          • MetaCubed@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            I was specifically referring to domesticated cats not being native to these regions since that was what is being discussed.

            • Dogyote@slrpnk.net
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              2 months ago

              I’d argue a housecat and a bobcat share a similar ecological niche. Haven’t the housecats simply replaced the bobcats that were largely removed by humans?

    • Adanisi
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      2 months ago

      I find it weird that Americans never let their cats outside. I mean, they’re outside animals.

      Would you stay indoors forever? No?

      • A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        You don’t let your cats out for the same reason zoos don’t let their bears out into your fucking neighborhood ya goddamn dingus. They don’t belong there and can do serious damage to the local fauna.

        also outdoor cats live an average of 3-5 years.

        Indoor cats live can for 15-20+.

        So sure, if you are pro-premature cat death. Let your pet cat outside.

        • Adanisi
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          2 months ago

          They don’t belong there

          They don’t cause serious ecological harm. Even the fucking bird preservation or whatever body says cats don’t have a serious impact on local bird populations.

          Oh and they do belong outside, actually. They come in and go out as they please.

          Outdoor cats live an average of 3-5 years

          Most cats are outdoor here, and live a damn sight longer than that. My own cat is 7 and counting. I have a relative who had an 18 year old cat.

          Maybe lifespan is different here because we don’t have 10-lane motorways every 10 meters in every direction.

          And for the record, if possible it is better for bears to be, well, outdoors in their natural habitat rather than a zoo.

      • Montagge
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        2 months ago

        Because we’re more responsible at this one thing apparently. They’re invasive. You want to let them outside take them to their native habitat.

        • Adanisi
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          2 months ago

          There are literally wild cats you can find, especially here.

          This pretty much is their natural habitat. 🙂

          But yeah tell me again how we’re all irresponsible for letting our cats breathe fresh air because they’re “iNvAsIvE”.

          • Montagge
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            2 months ago

            So you release your cat in the wild to kill the food source for native cats?

            • Adanisi
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              2 months ago

              Talking about my own country specifically here:

              They’re not really in competition. They’re mainly concentrated in the pretty much unpopulated highlands, whereas domestic cats owned by humans are mainly concentrated in the central belt.

              Scottish Wildcats are endangered technically, but not in terms of competition from domestic cats killing them or taking their food. Rather, they’re interbreeding (because they’re so similar!). That’s just evolution at the end of the day.

              Even though they’re still considered endangered because “pure” wildcats population is reducing, the wildcats are still living and creating offspring, some of which are still wild cats, even if they’re not purebred “wildcat”.

              • Montagge
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                2 months ago

                So irresponsible cat owners let their cats outside and didn’t neuter or spay them. Cool beans.

                It’s just evolution lol

                • Adanisi
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                  2 months ago

                  It’s irresponsible to not neuter or spay a housecat, yes. I agree. Most do but some irresponsible owners don’t.

                  It doesn’t change the fact that the only real danger domestic cats pose to wildcats is interbreeding. Which isn’t really a danger.

                  What they certainly aren’t doing is what you claimed: taking their food source. It’s just not a concern.

                  • Montagge
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                    2 months ago

                    Yet the subject was about what cats do to bird populations and you hopped in with your cat fucking gotcha. Good job in derailing the topic.