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I have been out of the loop on the Israel situation for so long and I feel maybe I should get in the loop. Can somebody educate me on it?
There is a pretty good headline summary written 100 years ago:
New York Times 1899: CONFERENCE OF ZIONISTS; Elect Delegates at Their Meeting in Baltimore. WILL COLONIZE PALESTINE
israel is isis w unlimited support from the usa
Israel was funded by Britain after WWII as an ethnostate for Jewish people. This was a win-win, since many Jewish people were tired of persecution and wanted their own country, and most other countries hated Jewish people to some extent and wanted to be rid of them.
They placed it in the region that was the Jewish state of Israel some 2 thousand years ago. Trouble is, there was another country in that place by then: Palestine. Most Palestinians are Muslim and look different from the Jewish people residing in Israel, which is unwelcome to an ethnostate. Ethnostates strive to be ethnically monogamous and don’t tolerate different ethnicities well.
Thus, Israel has been trying to get rid of Palestinians to varying extents since. This has indirectly been helped by many of the most powerful western nations, since Israel is their only ally in the middle east and they thus support it economically and in other ways. Tactics have mostly been passive enough to go under the radar of most people in different countries, for example economically depriving the region Palestinians live in, or letting too little food go to that region.
In late 2023, there was a terrorist attack on Israelis by a group called Hamas that identify as Palestian. This let to a full on war between Hamas and Israel. During this, there has been so much evidence of Israeli military targeting civilians and even specifically children that many people all over the world now recognize what Israel is doing to Palestinians as a genocide.
Anti-Israel sentiment is deliberately being painted as anti-Semitic by Israel. Some of it actually does contain some or even a lot of antisemitism, but some is just legitimate critique of an ethnostate and its actions against an unwelcome minority. Calling the latter antisemitism too has two results: the criticism is delegitimised and Israel gets away scots free, and actual antisemitism is on the rise because it feels more normalized now.
I tried to be objective, everyone please feel free to correct, add, or ask anything :) hope this helps OP!
We have to start accepting that israel is the modern day nazi state that must be deconstructed.
I lived in a West Bank settlement for 11 years. Israel’s reason for the war is ethnic cleansing and expulsion. They use the public support of the hostages to justify their actions. If you dare push back on their conquest you are called a self hating Jew and a Libtard.
Hamas are not the good guys here either, they played all their cards on October 7th where they demonstrated their cruelty and disrespect for human life. The Israeli military has been trying to match or exceed them ever since.
Shalom officer
Trying to exceed them? Trying? Try again.
Hamas are not the good guys here either, they played all their cards on October 7th where they demonstrated their cruelty and disrespect for human life. The Israeli military has been trying to match or exceed them ever since.
Weird how many of the Israeli claims of Oct 7 are either disproven or completely unbacked by any evidence. Beheaded babies? Rape and murder of dozens including noah aragami (who is alive, and released and now is going against Israel, why??? Asked the idiots)
Hamas is an Israeli puppet, they were placed to lead gaza to ensure Palestine can’t form into a nation, literal divide and rule. Hamas in gaza, plo/fateh in west bank who are opposing ideologies. I absolutely condemn Oct 7 and can’t comprehend why their plan or goal, not only is it cruel to the innocents but surely they knew Gaza would be wiped. Not that Israel is allowed to, just that Israeli propaganda is the strongest on earth
Weird how I never mentioned any of the Israeli claims. The facts are they swept through civilian areas killing and kidnapping seems fucked enough for me.
Where the fuck are you getting your propaganda? Noah Argamani? The woman posting pictures with Donald Trump on her socials?
Hamas was thought to be containable by Bibi’s government, they funneled cash to them hoping it would keep them complacent. Hamas proved on October 7th that they did not want to be Bibi’s “puppet”.!
Israel has been working on dividing the Palestinian people for almost as long as Israel has been a state. There were growing pro Palestinian rights movements growing in Israel but Bibi has been leaning hard into Oct 7th to reignite racist fears that Israelis are indoctrinated with their entire life. There are still movements in Israel that are pushing for hostage release and for Palestinian human and civil rights. Israel/Palestine will never be a healthy democracy until all peoples within it segmented borders are given equal civil and human rights.
Where the fuck are you getting your propaganda? Noah Argamani? The woman posting pictures with Donald Trump on her socials?
Here’s her socials from earlier. And then speaking at the UN:
“I need to make sure that the world knows that: the deal must go on in full … completely, in all the stages,” she told the Security Council before then describing how a house she was held hostage in was blown up, trapping her in the rubble.
All the stages, ie to end the war and have a lasting peace, not “bring them home now, no matter what”. Nobody is a perfect advocate, but speaking out against the official narrative and continued advocacy for a negotiated exchange is a huge start imo.
I don’t know if posing with Trump in front of a crowd of blood thirsty Evangelicals and Zionist is spreading the message of a lasting peace and security for all.
Stupid Hamas not handing out flowers to the people locking them into a concentration camp and killing over 33% active military soldiers and only 3% children under 18.
There are obvious reasons for the October 7th attack. Anyone denying that the Zionist government’s treatment of Palestinians for the better part of a century is either propagandized or choosing to not see.
Anybody justifying the murder of civilians on October 7th as a needed revolution but claims to be for peace and security for Palestinians needs to think long and hard about what peace and security is for Palestine. Anybody justifying Israel’s genocide/ethnic cleansing by citing October 7th needs to ask the very hard question of where does it end and what is the human cost.
For decades the Israeli government has propped up the puppet of a governing body that oversees the Palestinians population. The Palestinians Authority has no authority and has every motivation to keep the status quo. The change needs to come from within both societies. Israelis need to elect someone who believes in equal rights and will work with Palestinians for a mutual lasting peace and security deal. October 7th and the following assault on Gaza has pushed that process back years of not decades.
Nobody wins here.
Yeah, the Nazis just need to elect a better Hitler! That will solve everything!
There is an insane level of racism when you expect the genocided to lay down and take it because the genociders need to “elect better leaders”.
Your lack of knowledge about October7 is also telling. If you wish to gain some knowledge here is a video https://youtu.be/Pt_1k7nSv1M
I do not believe you lived on the West Bank by the way. You know far too little for that.
I hate people that insist anyone who sees an alternative path to lasting peace and security is a Zionist, racist or naive. It is going to take massive political and social changes for a mutual security to persist.
What qualifies you to be able to tell something like that? I don’t think you’ve lived in the West Bank, you know far too little for that and it shows.
The occupation/ethnic cleansing/genocide has gone on long enough. I hope people like you will support organizations like “Standing Together” instead of the same uprisings that have gotten us to this point.
I can believe it if you were an Israeli colonist on the West Bank.
The occupation/ethnic cleansing/genocide has gone on long enough.
That is what October 7 was about. Israelis aren’t dismantling their apartheid themselves.
I hope people like you will support organizations like “Standing Together” instead of the same uprisings that have gotten us to this point.
Liberal Zionist got us to this point. Not intifadas.
I like Hasan :3
I only form political opinions based on whether the person saying it is dude bro enough.
Politics is a popularity contest after all. That’s how Joe Rogan’s moronic “politics” got everywhere. At least Hasan has an idea what he’s talking about much of the time and does on-the-ground journalism.
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Democrats when Kamala loses and they see a leftist:
I’m not American.
Then you have even less if an excuse to be so stupid
For reference.
My comment was a statement on who the person who tweeted that politically supports.
My comment got removed on a false premise “personal attacks”. While true personal attacks to my person have not been moderated. This is a BIG moderation problem of this community.
This is a BIG moderation problem of this community.
Then leave 😊
He is correct, but is totally the wrong person to say this.
Because?..
Look into what Hasan says VS how he acts. He preaches socialism but steals money from other content creators constantly, as one example. He’s entirely two-side and just as bad as H3.
he streams 8 hours a day and has been for years. in this time he’s commented on countless videos, only about a handful having had problems with it. an overwhelming number of people welcome it.
jay exci had a particularly bad experience with it though so that led to some discussion about ethical streaming. at least since then hasan has taken concerns into consideration and has taken measures for it.
he makes sure his YouTube videos are transformative and demands it to be so on fan channels. he never reacts to creators that have had a problem with their videos being streamed. I’m pretty sure he even gets permission now a lot of times, at least there’s a huge number of creators who have made it clear that they’re ok with him streaming their videos because it helps them.
the notion that he steals is ridiculous. it’s transformative content. I don’t remember an instance where watching hasan talk about a video has replaced the video itself for me. in fact I don’t remember the last time I watched his take on a video before separately watching the video myself first.
Hasan is as bad as H3H3 genocide supporting Zionists because you do not understand how socialism works?
They both virtue signal towards different sides on that specific topic. But in their broader histories, they both just talk without research and bully random individuals for little reason. They both preach leftist politics yet choose to take from the less fortunate whenever they can.
Hasan is one of the most educated streamers pertaining the genocide constantly covering it at his own expense.
H3 is a genocidal Nazi maniac. Comparing the two shows how deeply unserious you are.
Hasan is a selfserving dickhead who poisons the well for most people not already into leftist politics. He refuses to be truly critical and reflective of stuff on his own side.
This kind of message needs to reach the “normies” to sway public opinion and put pressure on Israel to stop. But at the same time, with an 5 minutes google you see the dude brings Houthis onto his stream because “they’re just like Luffy.” That’s was not journalism, it’s was propaganda for clicks and views.
I see some of same bullshit the right pulls being done by him and his community. And I’m saying this as someone who agrees with most of his takes.
Ah so you need grifter Liberals to say it and not someone who had the correct take since the beginning.
Just admit Hasan was right all along and move on. No need to take even more Ls
Take it however you want to fit your narrative. Hasan himself said a thousand times at the beginning of his career that his objective was to be a gateway for normies to easily get into leftist politics. He lost sight of that along the way, and I blame both him and his community for it.
He’s literally the largest leftist streamer so he’s literally one of the most successful people at moving people left currently.
The Houthis are resisting the genocide in Gaza. The interview had as much journalistic value as interviewing John Brown (or at least one of his followers) would have. You’re engaging in some George Bush level shit. Don’t turn your brain off just because the state labels a group a terrorist organization.
He was the best at some point without a doubt, but now? You guys lost the election to Joe Rogan and friends and are still refusing to look into why.
And about the Houthis, you can gaslight all you want, but Hasan isn’t a journalist and it’s obvious when he tries to act like one. If I want real journalism, I’ll stick to the few places where it still exists, not some streamer sitting on his ass commenting on everything under the sun.
Why do you think the democrats lost the election?
Lost sight by speaking out against a genocidal Apartheidsstate at a time almost nobody dared to do because they were afraid to get cancelled for it? Such a poser that Hasan guy.
Yes, keep going and doing purity tests, you guys are doing an great job at stopping… nothing I guess? As a non-American, I never thought I’d see the American empire crumble from within like this, but unfortunately, I understand how it’s happening.
Have fun.
Genocide support is a pretty good place to draw a red line. Which encompasses most content creators… not named Hasan Piker.
Hasan is Andrew Tate with unlimited support from tankie bootlickers
Hasan is a criminal who brags about keeping women as sex slaves? Can you post a source?
How is Hasan like Tate of all people?
they both enjoy jacking off to authoritarian regimes
We may only like perfect people, smh.
I don’t really care about that. Hasan does more than most people online. He is objectively correct on 99% of all issues I see him talk about. He almost never talks about China and Russia, and when he does he always bring criticism.
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If you weren’t so abrasive you could come to like Hasan too :3
I feel like you’re holding advocates to a too high standard.
Source?
Mmhm, and MTG is just like AOC with unlimited support from Miriam Adelson coffers.
Lemmy is no better than reddit 🌚
I don’t necessarily disagree but Hasan literally plays Hamas propaganda videos on his streams. Is it really too niche to promote the views of people who don’t like Israel committing genocide and also don’t like Hamas?
Scary Hamas is not allowed a voice. Only Israeli propaganda allowed. No other perspectives!
Meanwhile over at CBS
I never said that only Israeli propaganda is allowed, not sure why you are bringing that up. I don’t speak for CBS either.
Let’s at least try to agree on the facts as follows:
- Israel has murdered Palestinian people and committed all sorts of atrocities (kidnapping, rape, etc.)
- Hamas has murdered Israeli people and committed all sorts of atrocities (kidnapping, rape, etc.)
- Israel has committed more atrocities than Hamas. It’s genocide, no doubt about it. Absolutely fucked up.
- Hamas is a terrorist organization that doesn’t speak for all Palestinians, and Palestinians don’t deserve to be murdered and displaced from their homes because of Hamas’ actions.
I think it’s important and meaningful to remember that these facts don’t cancel each other out. I think it shouldn’t be a nuanced take to denounce both these groups. Obviously the Israeli government needs to answer for the ongoing genocide of Palestinians. That doesn’t mean that we should blindly champion Hamas, which is what Hasan does regularly.
That is all I am saying. Hope you are well and hope you agree, take care.
These are not facts. The UN and the majority of the world does not classify Hamas as a terrorist organisation. The countries which do are complicit in the genocide…
Als Hamas has not raped people only Israel has.
Hamas propaganda is not a “perspective”. Keep that stuff at Lemmy.ml
Lemmy.ml does indeed show the perspective of the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto while you only want to see the Nazi side.
Keep going on about censorship though.
I guess I missed the day in history class when they talked about the Warsaw Ghetto firing hundreds of thousands of rockets at civilians, murdered babies, beheaded people and repeatedly vowed to drive every last German into the sea for 50 years.
You are describing Israel. Aka the Nazis. Know the difference. Here is an Israeli to explain it.
I don’t really get how the bad guys are a country fighting the literal Muslim Brotherhood who continue to hold American citizens and many others hostage for 529 days.
Whatever you say nazi
Islam is wrong but a jewish ethno state that was formed by killing civilians and babies is fine. Fk off. Israeli prisons have thousands of kids hostage but guess they are not white enough for you to care.
Lmao this is a lemmy dot world moderator. Fk off nazi.
Because they are attacking civilians, children, hospitals and UN aid deliveries, and have outspoken goals of removing all Palestinians from their homes. War crimes and ethnic cleansing seems like pretty bad guy stuff to me. Both sides can be bad.
True both sides can be bad, but one side made secularism illegal and is funded by actual terrorist organizations and the other is funded by a nation-state who actually is a secular multicultural society inclusive of LGBTQ people.
Just say you are a white supremacist.
No, fuck MAGA white supremacists and inbred fucks like you that supports them.
secular
The secular, explicitly Jewish state.
multicultural
With a system of apartheid and that’s committing genocide on another culture. I mean, I guess apartheid South Africa could also be described as “multicultural,” in the sense that multiple cultures existed, with one oppressing the other. Nazi concentration camps? Very multicultural.
inclusive of LGBTQ people.
That doesn’t recognize same-sex marriage and indiscriminately murders queer Palestinians alongside cishet ones.
Everything you said here is factually correct, in case anyone comes here to argue what you said.
So when you described them as a “secular, multicultural society inclusive of LGBTQ people,” you were lying, then.
If you had any actual reading comprehension and some level of functional reasoning you would see that i wasn’t describing the country of Isreal but rather who is supporting them.
Oh, I see, so it’s the US that’s rapidly descending into christofascism and conducting mass deportations and sending trans women to men’s prisons which is the “secular, multicultural society that’s inclusive of LGBTQ people,” and you’re just regurgitating shitty arguments used to justify the Iraq war because “inequality’s already been solved here, now we just need to take over other countries to force them to adopt our peaceful ways” except somehow even less coherent because the country that’s actually involved is completely indefensible and the people being targeted are being slaughtered even more indiscriminately.
I did read your “funded by” earlier, I just processed it as talking about like, the IDF being funded by Israel or something, because that’s the only thing that would be anywhere close to being relevant or resembling a point. If I donate $5 to one side in a conflict and then shoot up a playground, does that make the other side automatically justified? If I give one side a gun and then save a baby from a burning building, does that make that side automatically justified? How does this work in your mind, exactly?
Average lemmy.world moderator
Average zionazi*
Don’t harass mods, they volunteer a lot of time to the community, and they have their right to an opinion if they aren’t silencing others’.
I literally left lemmy.world as a user when the e-mail I used to register there was leaked and a Tel-Aviv based organisation started sending me e-mails to it, in my native tongue (which is not English), to attend their “Learn about Israel” online course.
I have little doubt in my mind that at least one of their admins is either a sockpuppet of a state actor or a rabid Zionist.
You can be pretty sure that if the former, their “Lemmy.world admin” time is being paid for.
The Israeli killing of US civilians goes back at least to 2003, when American activist Rachel Corrie was crushed to death in Gaza by an Israeli soldier driving an armored Caterpillar-brand bulldozer as she laid down to prevent it from moving to destroy Palestinian houses.
https://www.vox.com/israel/371491/aysenur-eygi-israel-palestine-west-bank-idf-biden-blinken
What Fanon implored us to do was to view the struggle of the oppressed as a struggle to create a new mode of being, a new form of humanity. Within the revolutionary struggles of the masses, he insisted, lie the seeds of a new humanity. The ongoing resistance in Palestine today is not a new phenomenon, but is rather the latest episode in a decades’ long struggle for freedom and what Hegel and Fanon both agree on, recognition. Not recognition to live within shrivelled little cantons and drip-fed subsistence, but recognition as a human being in the holistic sense of the term. The stone throwing, the stabbings and the bombings are a reaction to a colonial regime which denies this recognition.
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20151019-palestine-through-the-lens-of-frantz-fanon/
In an alternative reality where the literal nazi’s are fighting the Muslim Brotherhood, would that mean that the nazi’s are the good guys?
Fair enough. Assad was fighting ISIS, and he was still a genocidal maniac. Of course, Israel has a long way to go before they come anywhere close to that level of killing.
Both sides can be bad. There doesn’t have to be a good side in conflicts.
Both sides-ing a genocide is bad. Difference is one side is fighting eradication for their humanity and emancipation while the other is doing the eradication for supremacy and Colonialism.
Go on that link and check the editing list. It’s very interesting and worth looking at the dates and how it peaks Oct 7 2023
