Personally I think Facebook should face as much pushback as possible, unless we want them to do to this what Google did to XMPP.
If that is what users of this instance want then yes absolutely.
Personally I think we should, but I’ll open it to a poll in the next couple of days and the community can decide.
Where will this poll be posted? Did I miss it already?
Not posted yet, threads isn’t yet using activitypub protocol so no immediate decision to be made, but looking at creating a poll probably tomorrow. I’ll pin it to the top of the instance and leave it up for 24 hours.
If this instance is connected with Threads in any way then I’m out. If I wanted to use Meta’s services I’d be on Facebook, not here. Meta has shown time and time again that they have no morals and will do anything for more money and data.
From this article, it sounds like Threads won’t have ActivityPub federation enabled from the start. While I don’t want my entire feed dominated by brands and celebrities on Threads, I’m not convinced we should jump immediately to defederation. One of the reasons why I joined on this instance was the low defederation count. I’d lean more toward “wait and see” for now.
Yeah, they aren’t using AP federation right now.
I think we should be treating Facebook as an edge case when talking about defederation. It’s not like any other AP instance, due to it’s size and who is behind it (a monstrous, privacy destroying megacorporation).
Personally, I’m in support for defederating. Other than the obvious threat that Facebook’s size and history of anticonsumer behavior pose, its also about the type of content it brings.
One of the things I’ve been liking about lemmy so much is the general positive and welcoming vibe, and the well informed opinions. I have also been enjoying the lack of constant hate and general angriness, staples of any algorithm based social network feed.
The “difficulty” of having to seek out and join a fediverse instance, possibly write a few coherent sentences to join, is just enough to discourage the average Facebook/Instagram user, which I think is a feature. Growing the fediverse is important but growing at any cost I think is a mistake.
Oh hell I hope so. The threat is real and complacency could be our undoing. https://ploum.net/2023-06-23-how-to-kill-decentralised-networks.html
I can see the merit in arguments both for and against federation with meta.
- Pro: I like the idea of people discovering the Fediverse more easily through a mainstream outlet, and there has to be some benefit to be gained from the potential increase in the user base. I would like to be inclusive and see a diverse array of opinions, and “block 30 million people because they’re on a platform we don’t trust” doesn’t sit right with me.
- Con: I, too, have a very strong distrust for wealthy corporations and am sure that they are planning to eliminate us as “competition.” The thing that concerns me more, however, is the major instances that are trying to organize to not only defederate meta, but defederate any instance that refuses to do the same. This terrifies me; losing access to the meta community is one thing I’m on the fence about, but losing access to the instances that are already a part of our network would be devastating. In a way, it feels like Meta is already succeeding in destroying the fediverse without even connecting to it yet.
With how torn I am on the whole thing, I was thinking about a “wait and see” approach, but the con above kind of adds a sense of urgency. The deciding factor I landed on feels a bit silly, but I’m going to stand by it: I think that we should defederate from any “instance” that isn’t using open-source software. The ability for a user to know what’s in the software they’re using is the least-awful metric I can come up with to determine whether I feel like it should be a part of this world we’re building.
Is there a ELI5 for this? I’m not sure I understand enough to have an opinion on this :D
I get conceptually what defederation would mean (I think), but what effect would that have on Facebook? Less activity on their end making their product less succesful?
It’s more about protecting the fediverse.
If we don’t defederate, Facebook becomes the biggest instance and can throw it’s weight around, basically.
I see, yeah let’s not have that happen.
I’m in favor of not defederating. Corporations connecting to the Fediverse is inevitable as it grows. It’s not a bad thing.
On our own instance, we are free from the ads and dark engagement patterns of corporate social media, whatever they do.
The only reason not to federate would be to avoid having Threads overwhelm the culture of the existing Fediverse. Personally, I don’t mind that so much. Again, as we grow, this is inevitable.
I care a lot about the technology of ActivityPub and federation winning out, and I think staying federated with Threads for now is the right call to enable that.
I hope so
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If we do this, we could also harm the reputation of ActivityPub and the fediverse overall. Terrible instances would federate with them, while the good ones defederate. If that happens, people would think only those people are on a defederated network.
You think this would harm the instance more than federating with antivaxxer conspiracy theorists? We don’t need that kind of hateful content here, and Meta would absolutely bring it with them. Hostile political stuff about trans hate, anti abortion rubbish, we don’t need that. Meta would also massively outnumber everything else so that kind of content would end up flooding every aspect of the fediverse if allowed. Not to mention the privacy concerns.
Both sides are terrible and it is hard to decide at the end because of that
